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Hall of Fame baseball writer Hal McCoy is in his 36th year of covering the Cincinnati Reds, the longest tenure for any active writer covering one team. Counting spring training and postseason games, McCoy has covered more than 7,000 major-league baseball games, written close to 18,000 baseball stories and eaten enough hot dogs to give Babe Ruth indigestion.Home > Blogs > The Real McCoy | Cincinnati Reds baseball news > Archives > 2008 > August > 13 > Entry
Why Fogg and not Bailey?
Let’s play Two Questions (Twenty Questions takes too long).
ONE — Why is Josh Fogg still in the pitching rotation of the Cincinnati Reds when it is vivid that the season has been officially declared irretrievable?
Fogg has the same chance of being in the Reds rotation in 2009 as Hillary Clinton has of living in the White House next year.
TWO — Why isn’t Homer Bailey back in the rotation? Right now, his 0-6 record means nothing as far as where the Reds are headed this year ,and even if he finished 0-12 shouldn’t he be wearing a Reds uniform to see if he’ll be part of next year’s rotation?
Nevertheless, there was Fogg Wednesday night in PNC Park, pitching a meaningless game between the two worst teams in the National League Central.
And there was Fogg giving up four runs in the fifth inning that led to the Reds’ 5-2 loss to the Pittsburgh Pirates, pushing the Reds 20 1/2 games out of first place, 2 1/2 behind the next-to-last Pirates.
Fogg? He is 2-5 with a 7.96 earned run average for his 11 starts and six relief appearances. This is looking at the future?
Meanwhile, Bailey works in Louisville, where he has nothing to prove or show, although he said before he left he was looking forward to pitching for the Bats because they are in first place, they are having fun and the morale is good.
Bailey also said before he departed for horse country, “I’m considering this season a washout. I’ll start all over next year.” What he should have said was he was considering the season up to that point a washed-out bridge and he was starting all over at that point.
Right now. With the Reds. Not the Bats.
THE REDS’ OFFENSE against left-hander Paul Maholm consisted of two solo home runs, one by Corey Patterson in the third inning on his 29th birthday that gave Fogg a 1-0 lead and one by Jay Bruce in the seventh that broke his 0 for 11 skid after he hit into double plays his first two times.
The 1-0 lead after Patterson’s home run lasted for four innings as Fogg held the Pirates to no runs and four hits.
Fogg was good up to then and, as he said, “Was. The key word, was.”
Brandon Moss doubled to lead the fifth and Jason Michaels homered to make it 2-1.
Then Fogg issued two walks and single to load the bases and Ryan Doumit unloaded with a two-run double that nearly was a grand slam.
“I wasn’t throwing as many strikes in the fifth, walked a couple of guys, but mostly I wasn’t making the pitches I needed to make,” said Fogg. “After Michaels’ home run, the rest of the inning got away from me.
“If I’m able to get the third inning before Doumit hit the double and we’re still a 2-1 ballgame, but I wasn’t able to finish off the inning,” he added.
With the way the Reds are going and with their future map outlined without Fogg (a nice guy), he shouldn’t be able to finish off the season, either.
“Those walks in the fifth (by Fogg) is what set it up for the big boys to come up in the fifth,” said manager Dusty Baker. “We know Fogg is going to give you six or six-and-a-fraction.
“He gave up the home run (Michaels) and that made it 2-1, no problem, but then he lost command of the strike zone and it turned into a big inning.”
The Reds did very little with Maholm, either — two runs and seven hits over eight innings.
“These guys can turn some double plays, too (Bruce hit into two and Jolbert Cabrera one). And their third baseman (Freddy Sanchez) made some outstanding plays on us. He saved the day for them,” Baker added. “The left side of their infield is really alert when Maholm pitches because he is throwing sinkers and change-ups.”
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Comments
By ラフティング
September 21, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this
見てよ。By クレジットカード 現金化
September 21, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
検討に値する。By Gary
August 15, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this
the reason fogg is still pitching is that they have NO other pitching.The gm needs to be fired and get somebody that knows you can’t win without pitching.By BIRDIE41
August 14, 2008 7:22 PM | Link to this
to missingtombrowning,I think you better check your own spelling and grammar because on your comment that critcized my spelling you had at least 3 or 4 spelling and grammar errors.Maybe you need to double check your own mess before blasting someone else for their mistakes! I promise I will try to do better just for people like you that are perfect but think other people are not!By Ax
August 14, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this
Why is homer down and fogg up? There are a many reasons. First of all, good pitching at AAA does not necessarily mean good pitching at ML level. In his two rehab starts in Louisville, Fogg pitched a complete game allowing 3 runs, and a 8.0 inning 4-hit shutout, giving him a 1.59 era. Second, Bailey is not even pitching well at AAA level. In his last ten starts in Louisville, he has a 6.04 era, and a 0-4 record. Lets compare him to some other bats starters: Matthew Maloney: last 5 starts, not counting the time he got injured before recording an out: 1.67 era, 3-0, 6bb, 36k. Ramon Ramirez: last 6 starts, 1.99 era, 0-2, 14bb, 47k. Adam Pettyjohn: last 5 starts, not including aug 9th, where he gave up 10 runs in 5.1 innings, 1.12 era, 5-0, 2bb, 20k. Homer Bailey: last 5 starts, 5.36 era, 0-3, 10bb, 32k. I think that Malony, Pettyjohn, and especcaly Ramirez (who has made a Joba-esque change from releiver to starter in Louisville) deserve a promotion more then Bailey at this time. A few more notes: Homer always seems to break down when there are men on base. Ted Power and Rick Sweet are superior to Dick Pole and Dusty Baker. If next year Power is the pitching coach, Sweet is the manager, Ramirez is the #5 starter, and Josh Roenicke (great velocity) and Carlos Fisher (great movement, so many swinging strikes) are in the bullpen, the reds should have a much more winning team.By Y-City Jim
August 14, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
I don’t know if “pounded” is an accurate term to what is going on with Bailey. Of the seven hits he gave up last night, all but one was a single. I find it encouraging that the vast majority of the hits he has given up in his recent MLB and MiLB starts have been singles. That means they aren’t teeing off on him. He may be closer to being MLB-ready than we think and can be a legitimate contender for the No. 5 spot next spring.By bigdoc
August 14, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this
‘Don L’ is right—Homer was not improving. He was getting pounded. I don’t see how that helps him. It’s Fogg—because there is no one else. The guys at AAA are very fragile. Let Fogg fill #5.By Don L
August 14, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
I have a better question. Why Fogg or Bailey. Bailey at this point is a thrower and not a pitcher. He needs to work on his location and his breaking ball. He can do this at AAA, AA or even at A level. He does not and should not be at the major league level. He may never make it back and he shouldn’t if he can not repeatedly do those things. He can always get a job selling insurance.By ross
August 14, 2008 1:52 PM | Link to this
agree Mark..those guys cant play..we have no one to trade and the free agent list of outfielders is terrible.. please jock itch not pat burrell this is a awful baseball team now that jock face had something to proveBy Mark
August 14, 2008 1:48 PM | Link to this
Hasn’t it become painfully obvious to everyone that Dusty prefers playing veterans over younger players? This team is so far away from contention it isn’t even funny anymore. They have holes in left and center field, shortstop and catcher and no real prospects ready to fill those spots … and don’t argue that Dickerson, Stubbs, Janish and Hanigan are major-league ready prospects. If you are paying attention at all, you would know they are not.By ross
August 14, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
catch valentin..at least get some offense in that punch and judy lineup….keppinger is proving he cant play everyday..castellini please sell..keep berry and hatcher..jock itch needs to go..u screwed over Krivsky for this BUMBy Gary
August 14, 2008 1:15 PM | Link to this
the owner of the reds needs to fire the gm. they need to get pitching. they traded junior and dunn and really go nobody to replace them. pitching wins gamesBy Y-City Jim
August 14, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this
If you call up Lehr, he goes on the 40-man roster bumping someone more deserving of being there. He isn’t going to get any better results than Fogg. Unfortunately we are just playing out the schedule from the management viewpoint.By ross
August 14, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this
jock itch is a clown..castellini is good at a couple of things..lying and firing…i honestlt believe this team will rival the early 80’s teams that lost 100..i like all the injured pitchers we got for dunn…reason jock itch got fired in St Louis..this guy is worse then your boy that traded Casey for another 83mph pitcher Dave WilliamsBy ross
August 14, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this
nice watching fogg throw 83mph right down the middle…horrible..the Reds or deads are going to be terrible for many seasons..i cant believe castellini and jock itch..Dunn trade has done me in..will not come back to cracker box where the reds are going to try and win with speed no power for a HR parkBy Mike-Cinci
August 14, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this
It does not make a hoot of difference who the Reds play the rest of the year as most of the options are not everyday players. The Reds need to decide who they want as back up players next year. Cabrera, Andy Phillips, Freel, Hairston can play multiple positions. Valentin can play 1B and catcher. Can Dickerson stick as a 4th or 5th outfielder? Is Keppinger an everyday player or a nice sub? Is EE the future at 3B? Can Rosalies be a good back-up? What about Hopper? Is Hannigan good enough to be a back-up catcher? He is 28 and clearly not a prospect. The Reds can keep some of these guys or none of them. Regarding Homer Bailey let him finish the season at Louisville. He was getting bombed this year in the majors. Let the poor guy start over next Spring. The Yonder Alonzo situation borders on ridiculous. This is either a game of chicken and he will sign or this is an absolutely dumb draft choice by the Reds. He is a first baseman. The Reds already have Votto. He said he wanted $7 million to sign. The Reds took a chance he would sign for $3 million. Maybe he will but if he does not the team wasted another important draft pick. If he does not sign the Reds get their own top pick plus the #8 pick next year. That will cost big money for unproven players. Who knows if the Reds will be smart enough to make wise choices next year. The situation is bleak. This is a bad baseball team. Jocketty has his work cut out for him.By Mark in Sun Valley
August 14, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
MacBeth was DFA from the 40 man roster when we acquired Massey from Chicago. So the Reds got nothing for him, which means we got nothing for Denorfia. Too bad since we seem so short of outfielders. I wonder it Drew Stubbs will be rushed to the majors next year. I’d like to see as many of the younger players as possible, with the exception of Bailey. He has a lot of things to work on and I do not think Dick Pole is the person to advise him. I’d rather have Ted Power try to straighten him out.By SethMM
August 14, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
Correction: Sanchez was playing 2B last night. The guy Dusty saw flashing the leather the last two nights was Andy LaRoche, newly arrived from the Dodgers.By Pete
August 14, 2008 9:49 AM | Link to this
Y-City Jim…. U R correct. I read the transaction wrong. OOPPSS!! Not certain what (if anything) the Reds receive(d). Bottom line, McBeth wasn’t all he was touted to be.By Steven Ross
August 14, 2008 9:49 AM | Link to this
Why ask why! The Reds make head-scratching moves. Fogg’s had success in the past but he’s not part of our future. However, I doubt Homer is either. Give somebody else a chance. Speaking of not being in our future plans, neither is Patterson but there he is in the lineup! Is Bako, in Baker’s eyes, the next Johnny Bench, in our future plans? Nope! Yet against RH pitchers, he’s our catcher. Dusty simply holds us back. He’s not the answer. Jocketty knows it and will bring in his own manager next year. There’s your new lead Hal.By donb51
August 14, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this
Hal, You are right on the money with this. Baptism by fire is the only way to gain the right experience in the quickest amount of time. War games (AAA) can only do so much. But you learn twice as quick when a real bullett nearly takes your head off. Let’s get all our young boys all the experience they can get right now. Send all the war veterans to the training camps to teach the next set of potential big leaguers. That’s how Patton would have done it.By Miss Baseball
August 14, 2008 9:29 AM | Link to this
If the Reds don’t want Homer Bailey then I want Justin Lehr up here in stead of Fogg. If the Reds traded or released him there is the 40 man spot they would need for the young man with his 2.17 era with the bats. Just to note Bailey’s era is 4.50. Let the kids get the experience now and that should help them next year, and not just the pitchers.By Miss Baseball
August 14, 2008 9:29 AM | Link to this
If the Reds don’t want Homer Bailey then I want Justin Lehr up here in stead of Fogg. If the Reds traded or released him there is the 40 man spot they would need for the young man with his 2.17 era with the bats. Just to note Bailey’s era is 4.50. Let the kids get the experience now and that should help them next year, and not just the pitchers.By bill
August 14, 2008 9:10 AM | Link to this
When this team becomes Jocketty’s team it will be the same results. Remember, he doesn’t have the budget that he had with his previous teams!By Y-City Jim
August 14, 2008 8:43 AM | Link to this
I assume you mean the Red Sox picked up McBeth from the Reds. The Reds probably did the deal because McBeth is 28-years-old and has a 6.20 ERA at Louisville in 24 innings of work. What are the Reds getting? Cash?By Mike-Cinci
August 14, 2008 8:17 AM | Link to this
KC traded Carlos Beltran to Houston a few years ago at the trading deadline for 3 prospects(Teahen, Wood, Buck). Beltran had a great 2 months with the Astros who won the NL pennant, but lost in 4 straight in the World Series. Beltran signed a $119 million, 7 year contract with the Mets after the season. KC is still lousy. Houston has never won a World Series game in their history and has faded since the 2005 season. Beltran has been a disappointment with the Mets. He has not lived up to his contract…at least not yet. Beltran is a nice player but is not worth $119 million. Very, very few are.By Pete
August 14, 2008 8:01 AM | Link to this
OK… here’s another fer ya…. YAHOO sports notes that the Reds acquired Marcus McBeth off waivers from Boston. I’ve only one question on that move — WHY?By Y-City Jim
August 14, 2008 7:56 AM | Link to this
I’d rather see Bailey stay down and continue to work on his development. That way he is ready next year. We paid Fogg so let him pitch.By Pete
August 14, 2008 7:38 AM | Link to this
Fogg’s a .500 pitcher @ best. Yeah, he’s had a bit of success. Yet he’s not in any way a solid starter, never has been. He could possibly be a bullpen guy for someone (not the Reds). Bailey, simply needs to grow up. Somewhere between his draft day several years ago & now, his head has gone somewhere other than the pitching path. There may be alot of reasons why that’s happened. But I know who can’t fix his problems — DICK POLE!By Z-Bro
August 14, 2008 2:39 AM | Link to this
I totally agree, Hal. Patterson, Fogg, and anyone else not going to be on the team next year should not play unless it is an emergency. Maybe this is too simple to understand for the GM? This is a great time to get the hardknocks in for the young players. Bailey can throw 10 shut-outs in a row at AAA and help them win it all, but he needs to build confidence at the next level. He’s already been there and done that at AAA. The Reds’ management must get this in their heads and start ASAP.By Z-Bro
August 14, 2008 2:38 AM | Link to this
I totally agree, Hal. Patterson, Fogg, and anyone else not going to be on the team next year should not play unless it is an emergency. Maybe this is too simple to understand for the GM? This is a great time to get the hardknocks in for the young players. Bailey can throw 10 shut-outs in a row at AAA and help them win it all, but he needs to build confidence at the next level. He’s already been there and done that at AAA. The Reds’ management must get this in their heads and start ASAP.By Beard
August 14, 2008 2:24 AM | Link to this
Bailey, Thompson, Malooney anyone over Fogg. Same thing for Patterson why isn’t Dickerson going here. Get over it Dusty this team just isn’t going to do much the rest of this year. It is time to see what the candidates who might help the team next year can do. I don’t see Fogg, Patterson, or Bako in the Reds plans for ‘09 so why see them in the lineup anymore in ‘08? Get with the program Dusty and fill out a lineup with Dickerson and Hannigan every day for the rest of this year I don’t care if Warren Spahn and Steve Carlton are throwing it is time to get Dickerson (and Bruce and Votto) at bats against tough lefties and it is time to throw Hannigan to the fire. Let Bailey learn another pitch here too if Fogg is all the Reds have to offer. It simply doesn’t matter. In fact, I’ll surmise that the more the Reds lose the better it is as they’ll get a higher draft choice. With Alonso looking like he may not sign the Reds could have 2 picks in the top 10 next year. That will be prove to be huge if they could get two players that are able to follow the same track as Bruce did as a top 10 pick (though he was 12th you get my point).By MAC
August 14, 2008 1:44 AM | Link to this
P.S. the Bats just got J. Lehr back from Korea; why not give him a try since no one else seems ready or worthy?By MAC
August 14, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this
Good pts by all, but I have to agree w/ Don on Homer. This kid is totally screwed up w/ his windup/mechanics/psychee to the pt that he has lost all confidence in his abilities on the mound. In an effort to improve his location, the Reds altered his windup and he lost any aggressiveness in the process. Other than what Don already mentioned, Homer needs to stop over thinking his mechanics and work on locating ALL his pitches better. If he rushes and doesn’t find a balance pt and forgets his mechanics, he loses good location on his pitches. If he slows down and over emphasizes his mechanics, he starts aiming the ball and loses any bite or snap on his pitches. For Homer to be successful again IMO, he needs to find the middle ground and that can best be worked on @ AAA. As for Fogg, hopefully the Reds can move him for something? Many teams are looking for some veteran help for the back end of their rotation; perhaps Fogg could be that guy and the Reds can get another option for the future?By HuberTucky
August 14, 2008 1:10 AM | Link to this
Agree with your premise here, Hal, regarding Fogg & Bailey. At this point the Reds are simply rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.By Steve
August 13, 2008 11:03 PM | Link to this
Hal, I agree that it’s a waste of a start to have Fogg pitch. On the other hand it seems like Homer does have a few things to be working on away from the glare of the major leagues for a few weeks. He’ll be back in September. I wish we had some other SP to try instead, though. It’s sort of a sad situation that we don’t. How long will Dusty stick with Corey Patterson once Jerry Hairston gets back? And how often will we have to watch Paul Bako struggle at the plate? Dickerson added some excitement last night, not to mention doing a good job leading off and playing LF, so obviously he gets a night off.By Don
August 13, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this
Last time in AAA, Bailey was still posting an ERA of over 4.00. In his quick rehab stint, Fogg pitched quite well in AAA. Bailey is unproven, volatile, and young. Fogg is a veteran. Maybe Fogg can no longer pitch at this level, but unlike Bailey, he has enjoyed a certain amount of success at the big league level and is probably more confident in his abilities at the big league level than Bailey. And why subject Bailey to this losing attitude that exists in Cincy? If the Reds are looking to change the mindset of losing and looking toward a youth movement to do that, would it not then be counterproductive to leave Bailey in Cincy during a time where morale and winning are at an all time low? Wouldn’t he be better served to win and stand the chance of enjoying more personal success than to stay in Cincinnati, be a part of a terrible team, and get his brains beat in every five days? Maybe Fogg shouldn’t be in Cincinnati, but if he isn’t, Bailey isn’t the one who should replace him.