By hydrogen generator

May 18, 2011 3:53 PM | Link to this

pretty valuable stuff, overall I imagine this is worthy of a bookmark, thanks

By Squirrellygirl

March 1, 2011 9:34 AM | Link to this

Don’t shoot me. I’m just the piano player…here’s the link: http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/7798594/secclintonadmitsfundingopposition.html?cat=9 Before you misled union sheep call it a conspiracy theory again, please go to this link.

By Squirrellygirl

March 1, 2011 9:28 AM | Link to this

Not admitting what is going on in the world, turning your head and denying while people are dying, is not going to help anyone. Accusing people of being crazy while they post information that proves what they have been exclaiming is not helping anyone. Here is part of an article regarding our unions supporting the rebellion in Egypt: While the ties to Labor Unions and the Egyptian youth revolution have been brushed off as a conspiracy theory a recent interview with Secretary of State Hilary Clinton actually reveals the relationship. Interviewed for Masrawy.com, an Egyptian news site, Secretary Clinton confirms the long standing relationship with Egyptian labor unions and their State Department funding. The Secretary also acknowledges that the government of Egypt wasn’t at all happy about this support according to the State Department transcript.

By Mike R

February 28, 2011 10:00 PM | Link to this

ClarkOHrepub, lifting the cap and perhaps means testing will help with Social Security/Medicare, but it won’t have much of an impact on many state finances. Currently 30% of Ohio’s budget goes towards mandated Medicare expenditures. Lifting the limit from the current $106,800 will help, but it won’t solve the problem. Nor would I consider people who earn $107K “ultra rich.” Some of the most wealthy income earners are protected from the unions—professional athletes and entertainers. I did a study last year showing that if just the MLB, NHL, NBA, and NFL players contributed to an uncapped FICA an additional $1.5 BILLION per year in revenue would be generated. Unfortunately, it would literally take an act of Congress to get those millionaires to pay FICA Taxes—I don’t see that happening anytime soon.

By ClarkOHrepub

February 28, 2011 6:43 PM | Link to this

We must look at this issue objectively people…because people’s lives are at stake. On one hand we cannot afford business as usual. On the other, we must get people working…not on unemployment. While the left claims the ‘rich’ don’t pay enough taxes, the truth is there is little to tax. The ultra rich DO need to step up and accept uncapped FICA taxes on earnings…that would go a long way in one respect. On the other, public unions need to step up and accept contributing more to their benefit programs. We should stop the flame throwing and start having a real dialog people!

By Squirrellygirl

February 28, 2011 12:48 PM | Link to this

The unions are supported by the socialist and communist parties. Does that give anybody here a warm fuzzy feeling about the unions? Have you listened to how they talk at the union demonstrations? Some of the union members at the demonstrations laugh when they are told they are standing by communist demonstrators with their flags and signs depicting the same. But they are, so…what does that make them? Morons?

By mckeestown

February 28, 2011 12:21 PM | Link to this

The Communist Party USA urges the widest possible solidarity with public workers all over our country. We especially salute the workers and demonstrators in Madison, Wisconsin who have captured the imagination of the nation with their powerful and peaceful protest against union busting and crass efforts to destroy the livelihoods of thousands of dedicated public workers. Teachers, health care workers, firemen, sanitation workers, Emergency workers, police and municipal workers of all kinds are under severe, nationally coordinated attack by rightwing Republicans and some conservative Democrats.

By mckeestown

February 28, 2011 12:21 PM | Link to this

The Communist Party USA urges the widest possible solidarity with public workers all over our country. We especially salute the workers and demonstrators in Madison, Wisconsin who have captured the imagination of the nation with their powerful and peaceful protest against union busting and crass efforts to destroy the livelihoods of thousands of dedicated public workers. Teachers, health care workers, firemen, sanitation workers, Emergency workers, police and municipal workers of all kinds are under severe, nationally coordinated attack by rightwing Republicans and some conservative Democrats.

By Just sayin'

February 28, 2011 11:21 AM | Link to this

Navin, you NEVER said you were quoting from an story about the civil service test fiasco. You said it as a statement of your own. Besides, if blacks and whites come from the EXACT same school and the EXACT same educational system and it appears that only the blacks struggle with the Civil Service exam, is that really a problem with the educational system. I believe that is more of a cultural issue, than a systemic one. Only a racist would assume otherwise.

By Just sayin'

February 28, 2011 9:27 AM | Link to this

Navin…. nothing you said inferred racism? Really? Who the heck brought blacks into the conversation. You said: “The city cannot find enough black applicants educated well enough to pass a civil service test to qualify to become a policeman or a fireman. Tell me why is that?”. The statement makes PERFECT sense if you leave the word black out! Why did you say BLACK. It’s because you are a racist. Do you really think it’s me that is obtuse? What a fool!

By tacomomma

February 26, 2011 10:13 PM | Link to this

It would be awesome if our teacher’s union had anywhere near the power some folks seem to think it has. We don’t demand or bully. We do not have anything in our contract that the school board doesn’t agree to. People seem to forget that point. We do, however, work hard to see that our teachers are treated fairly. A friend of mine teaches in a district where the administrators got a 10% pay increase while they were telling the community they were broke. Why didn’t the public scream when those administrators got a 10% raise (the teachers got 1%.) Maybe because no one knew?? This year, the teachers did fight against paying more for insurance - why? Because the administrators were paying NOTHING for their health insurance. Teachers felt if it was a true crisis then everyone should feel the pain. Now at least SOME of them are paying the same percentage as teachers. Again, people don’t know these things. Merit pay doesn’t work - has been shown time and time again. How do you judge a special ed teacher? A PE teacher? An Art teacher? When you cannot control all of the variables, you cannot control all of the results. If you are unhappy with the state of education, then contact your school board - they control the curriculum. Teachers have very little say - again most people don’t know that. And as for the petty comments about teachers and their grammar and spelling - get a grip. People are typing quickly - excited to get their comments out - everyone makes mistakes and it has nothing to do with the art of teaching.

By KCM

February 25, 2011 6:37 PM | Link to this

@Navin- I was more referring to your statements of “Graduation rates are atrocious, and a % of those who graduate are functionally illiterate” and “If you have been reading these posts over the past few weeks, teachers seem to blame it on anything and everything, except the quality of education they provide.” Admittedly I shouldn’t have mentioned tests and been more clear about what part of your comment I was referring to. According to Kasich and Senator Jones this is a “budget issue” and not a union issue. Both have failed to explain how these bill will help close the budget gap.

By Paul

February 25, 2011 5:22 PM | Link to this

Most middle-class workers are Non-union taxpayers. Democrats keep proving over and over, with Obama in bed with the union… Democrats don’t care about you if you’re non-union, and that’s Most of the middle class.

By Mike R

February 25, 2011 5:09 PM | Link to this

Navin, I understand where you are coming from. This is a teacher issue (i.e, throw more money at the problem and watch the results get worse) as it’s perpetuated by the Department of Education. But it is also a societal issue too. Much of this has to do with the social engineering mandated by liberal Democrats begining in the 1960’s. 45% of test takers passed the test you refer to. Only 25% of blacks who took the test passed. It was graded on a curve. Perhaps more disturbing is this test process is to find new firefighters/police officers. Under the current CBA many police and firefighters HAVE to retire. Now, not all of them want to and they are still physically able to carry out their duties, but under the current agreement they must start collecing taxpayer funded retirements—The exact thing that Kasich and other governors want to end. Seriously, why force someone out to pasture if they don’t want to retire and can still do the job—with experience?? Hmm. In addition to taxpayer funded FORCED retirments the City of Dayton has paid $600,000 in penalties to the Department of Justice and hired a CALIFORNIA firm to recruit and teach minorites to take the test. I find it hard to believe hard working women and men that were forced to join unions to get and keep jobs wants their tax money spent this way…

By Navin Johnson

February 25, 2011 4:27 PM | Link to this

KCM, sorry to see that you also suffer from the inability to read and comprehend. Again, I was asking questions based of the civil servant test fiasco from a few weeks ago. I made no personal comment. Facts are facts, it is not a made up story. I never inferred that all black people can’t pass the test. check the DDN archives for the articles and you might just understand my point. When you have a certain group that seems to be not getting as much out of an education as they should, to me that’s a big problem. I’m sure there are many valid reasons, but these conversations are about unions and some posters made references to terachers. The only personal statement I made was calling the other poster an idiot. Use your brain!!

By KCM

February 25, 2011 4:00 PM | Link to this

@Navin- Not all african american graduates can’t pass the tests. What about districts such as Centerville, Beavercreek, Oakwood and Bellbrook whose test scores have been consistently high? Are you saying there are better teachers there than in Dayton Public where test scores are lower? Look at the situations the students come from and external factors before blaming all teachers. Do I think all teachers are good? No.

By Leslie

February 25, 2011 3:50 PM | Link to this

The founders of the labor movement viewed unions as a vehicle to get workers more of the profits they help create. Government workers, however, don’t generate profits. They merely negotiate for more tax money. When government unions strike, they strike against taxpayers. F.D.R. considered this “unthinkable and intolerable.” Government collective bargaining means voters do not have the final say on public policy. Instead their elected representatives must negotiate spending and policy decisions with unions. That is not exactly democratic – a fact that unions once recognized. Up through the 1950s, unions widely agreed that collective bargaining had no place in government. But starting with Wisconsin in 1959, states began to allow collective bargaining in government. The influx of dues and members quickly changed the union movement’s tune, and collective bargaining in government is now widespread. As a result unions can now insist on laws that serve their interests – at the expense of the common good.

By Squirrellygirl

February 25, 2011 3:40 PM | Link to this

I think the vocal minority is bullying the rest of us. They scare me. They say scary things like “We know where you live” (I saw it on video). They carry signs that have communist logos on them. I saw some union people attacking people on video at some of the town meetings that were held a while back. They yell over people when they are talking, like they are forcing the unions on us. They have made unions mandatory to get contracts in Ohio and are driving costs/services up, and we’re broke and we can’t afford to give them our money anymore. The more I see Obama in bed with them, the more I don’t trust them. They scare me. I venture to say that their antics have scared many more Americans, too. If the peaceful gatherings of tea partiers are found scary by people like Pelosi, imagine how the real thing can be scary when you see people being beat up by union thugs. We noticed it. Enough said.

By Leslie

February 25, 2011 3:25 PM | Link to this

American workforce (quoting US Labor stats 6.9% of private workers, and just over 32% of public employees are in unions). 88% of working people are not in a union and may have concerns about being bullied by a very vocal minority.

By Navin Johnson

February 25, 2011 2:32 PM | Link to this

Just Sayin’… reread my post. I said nothing of the kind. I asked a question based on the post by Tough Guy Huh. I was questioning him about the quality of education in this area if black graduates cannot pass a civil service test. Do you remember the story in the DDN just a few weeks ago? In no way anything I said remotely inferred racism on my part. I guess in this day and age you can’t even ask a question. Clearly you need to work on your comprehension skills. Are you really this obtuse? Playing a card? You seem all too eager to accuse someone of playing the race card. That usually happens when you can’t think of anything else to say. You are the idiot.

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 2:20 PM | Link to this

Sorry about the wrong number Mike. I was just using firefighters number he threw out.Thank you for the correct information,it makes my point stronger about what we in the private sector pay.

By Mike R

February 25, 2011 2:03 PM | Link to this

Perspective’s numbers are off a bit. FICA taxes, directly paid by employee, this year are 5.65%. 4.2% is Social Security and 1.45% is Medicare. Last year and next year the rate will be 7.65% (6.2% for Social Security). However, private employees really pay 15.3% (excluding this year) as the employer has to pay matching taxes. The employer’s portion comes directly from the employee through lower salaries and benefits.

By Squirrellygirl

February 25, 2011 1:22 PM | Link to this

America needs to be able to compete with other countries, but as long as we allow unions to drag us down and skyrocket our costs of services/products, we won’t be able to compete and win. We have been watching businesses leave Ohio because we have some of the highest state taxes. People in Ohio are tired of the hard times caused by all of the layoffs, and we’re tired of the same ol’ same ol’ and we don’t believe the rhetoric coming out of the administration. We voted in new representatives. We need changes that won’t drive our economy off the deep end. We don’t want the changes that will change our country from a Republic to Communism. We are very close to losing our freedom as we know it. For the present, I’m afraid of being layed off due to the government reps taking this week off and not coming to an agreement. Democrats are willing to shut down our government because they don’t want to let go of their entitlements, the run away spending that we cannot afford. Everyone is watching what they are going to do next week. I’m scared because I don’t think the Democrats got the message from the voters last election!

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 1:13 PM | Link to this

@firefighter We pay that 3% social security (which most of us will never receive back what we’ve paid in) and then if we expect to survive we put money into 401k’s or IRA’s.Sounds to me like you left the private sector a long time ago because very few companies now pay 100% of their employees insurance costs. You act like you’re the sole authority since you’ve “been on both sides” but you aren’t. I’ve seen lots of posts here talking about how much better pay is in the private sector but very few of the union people are willing to post their wages.(I only saw one teacher who whined about 60k a year not being enough)It’s quite interesting if you think about it. I’ve been in the private sector all my life but I have had the experience of working side by side with union tradesmen. When I would go to GM to work on the electronic HVAC controls I would be assigned 2 electricians because I was not allowed to use any sort of tools except my laptop to interface with the systems.Now rarely was there ever any need to change wiring,mostly was programming,but yet 2 GM tradesmen who were making at least $25 an hour babysat me the whole time for fear I would “do their work”.Ah yes,the union way. Funny that GM plant is closed now.

By Just sayin'

February 25, 2011 1:10 PM | Link to this

What does being black have to do with it Navin? Are you really playing that card? Not hiring someone because you don’t like the color of there skin is despicable, but on the other hand hiring someone solely for the same reason is equally despicable. The only criteria we should have is QUALIFICATIONS!!! You’re starting to sound like that racist idiot Pringle from Middletown.

By Squirrellygirl

February 25, 2011 1:09 PM | Link to this

To Fire: I’ve been on both sides. 18 yrs with government, took buyout, and wasn’t given unemployment so had to live off of it. I’ve also worked with the private sector for about 15 years, but have relatively nothing saved up for retirement (due to layoffs and having to draw out my retirement, paying 30% back to the govt for the privilege). I currently pay in 6% to my 401K and get 75% of the first 6% of pay contributions, but I think you have to be fully vested to get that…not sure about the details. I use to pay 6% in and get only 3% contrib from employer. In any case, if I get layed off and have to w/d contributions, I will again have to pay the government 30% of it…job security is not good right now. As a government contractor, I might get layed off if the gov’t shuts down. I don’t get paid when the base shuts down for snow days (like all of the civilians got paid when it shut down in Feb for 2 and 1/2 days!!, but most of the contractors didn’t get paid for those days). Whenever there is late arrival or early departure due to weather, civilians always get paid for the lost time, and as a contractor I have to take leave or leave without pay.

By Squirrellygirl

February 25, 2011 1:00 PM | Link to this

To Fire: I pay $40 every 2 weeks for inferior insurance. In order to get similar insurance to what I use to have it would have cost me $150 each 2 weeks, and that’s just for individual—not family. I’m single and that’s what it costs for just single insurance. That would have taken most of my raise (it was a different contractor, different contract, etc.).

By firefighter

February 25, 2011 12:18 PM | Link to this

Hey squirrellygirl, You said you pay $150.00 for your insurance. Well that is exactly what I pay for insurance. As sgt said we also pay a percentage of our pension. I also pay for outside investments for retirement. What do you pay for your retirement? 3% for social security and what else.I have worked in both sectors, as a matter of fact When I left the private sector I did not pay a dime for insurance. I had better benefits in the private sector. If you have not been on both sides you don’t have the right to judge. Don’t rely on hearsay…..

By Navin Johnson

February 25, 2011 11:53 AM | Link to this

Tough guy Huh? The city cannot find enough black applicants educated well enough to pass a civil service test to qualify to become a policeman or a fireman. Tell me why is that? Since you clearly do not beleive its because the system is broken and the schools are providing a quality education, you must think it is some other reason? Please tell us what that could be. Oh, just pay teachers more and these problems will go away? Graduation rates are atrocious, and a % of those who graduate are functionally illiterate, hence the lack of ability of high school graduates to pass a civil service test.If you have been reading these posts over the past few weeks, teachers seem to blame it on anything and everything, except the quality of education they provide. After reading your post, I’d say that you fall into that category. Blow it out your butt? What an intelligent well thought out way to express yourself, what’s next, a rousing up yours, or everybody’s favorite…so’s your old man.

By Squirrellygirl

February 25, 2011 11:46 AM | Link to this

I didn’t say anywhere that public employees don’t pay taxes or aren’t taxpayers; however, I do say, and have said over and over again that they need to be at least close to the same as what we pay for our benefits and pensions. We aren’t, and that’s the problem. You can say all day long that the unions for public and private are different, but they are still unions. They are still getting in the way of bargaining, and the unions (public and private) are using funds from their members to fund uprisings in Wisconsin, in Ohio, in Egypt, and elsewhere. You can stomp your feet, but it’s still true. Unions drive up the cost of products/services. We won’t be competitive as longs as unions are mandatory. Kasich is doing what the taxpayers voted him in to do. He’s going to turn around the deficit that was created under Strickland’s watch by making Ohio a more business friendly state. That in turn will bring in more businesses that will hire people here in Ohio, which will take them out of the unemployment lines. I agree that the Democrats who don’t show up to do their jobs should be fired, and unable to reapply, and that there should be provisions made to replace them immediately. Also, if they are found to have intentionally abused their power in their positions, they should be prosecuted. The teachers in Wisconsin who are found to have brought in fake doctors notes should also be replaced IMMEDIATELY. If these people are untrustworthy, they shouldn’t be trusted with our school children.

By Mike R

February 25, 2011 11:24 AM | Link to this

@tough guy huh: You made the case that teachers take pay cuts. Kasich had a salary of $50K while at OSU. The lastest data available, by the Ohio Department of Education, shows teachers on average earned $55,583.44 in FY2009. http://odevax.ode.state.oh.us/htbin/F2009-DISTRICT-PROFILE.COM?irn=043737+Centerville+City+SD+%28Montgomery%29

By tough guy huh

February 25, 2011 10:34 AM | Link to this

Oh, blow it out your butt. Competition is not a panacea, especially in the age of enormous conglomerates. I am happy with the education my kids are getting. And the schools are sufficiently innovative. Wouldn’t want them in a Chinese school. Talk about totalitarianism. Oh, and if you want to attract top teachers in a really competitive market — you will have to PAY them. Duh. The fact remains that Kasich and his ilk are big fat ugly lying hypocrites. How about we pay teachers what he earned at OSU? We are still extracting ourselves from the mess the R’s left us in @ middle east, Wall Street, and their complete failure to come up with any constructive plans for the future.

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 10:08 AM | Link to this

Here’s a couple of the hiding Democrats whining about the hardship that THEY have put themselves under by REFUSING to do the job they are paid to do.(kind of sounds like a strike doesn’t) http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/demshidinginplainspite_bcyL61HUd3DmjU5u1KH8cM

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 8:44 AM | Link to this

And then there’s this. http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2011/02/solyndra-obama-biden-stimulus-waste.html

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 8:17 AM | Link to this

Oh yes,for those of you who keep saying Republicans are for big business.I present this for your reading enjoyment. http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/02/new-soros-hedge-fun-profiting-obamas-green-energy-push-hires-top- Who is for big business?

By IAFF/FOP are Unions by definition

February 25, 2011 8:09 AM | Link to this

To Sgt. - From Todays Journal: City leaders and the Fraternal Order of Police – Ohio Labor Council were unable to agree on a fact-finder’s report regarding salary increases and other benefits for the city’s dispatchers and corrections officers……… Not a Union eh? If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck, it’s probably a duck.

By Union Logic?

February 25, 2011 8:01 AM | Link to this

Sarge, it’s still a Union scam. You said it again. ” it ensures that you are still contributing the same amount as those that are members of the FOP/IAFF. You can not do this in a “UNION.” You can call it whatever you want Sarge, it’s still FORCING you to give up a portion of your check. Like I said, if you OPT out of the Frat House, you should not have ONE CENT taken from your check. PERIOD!!

By Perspective

February 25, 2011 7:34 AM | Link to this

Remember the Republicans being called the party of NO because of their votes against Bills put forth by the Democrats? Where is all the uproar over elected state politicians in Wisconsin and Indiana leaving their states to avoid voting altogether and hold up the lawmaking process? I’d say the Democrats are the party of NO SHOW. It’s really telling if you think about it. They can’t get their way so they run away and hide.The Democrats are holding out against Democracy. Imagine the hue and cry raised if Republicans pulled such a stunt. Personally I think they should be fired and special elections held to replace them.(with the ones fired not being able to run,they’ve already proven they have no respect for our system of govt.) Say what you want but at least the Republicans did not shirk their duty when the Dems held the majority.

By Paul

February 25, 2011 2:37 AM | Link to this

No other workers have “tenure” or guaranteed employment—only teachers. And, our education system is a Failure! U.S. has fallen way behind other countries. Over 50% of Wisconsin 8th graders - can’t read to satisfactory standards. Unions have ruined manufacturing; unions have ruined our Education system, and made it more expensive than it needs to be.

By things are tough all over

February 24, 2011 11:29 PM | Link to this

@things are tough all over?, How about this! The Chinese are #1 in math ,and # 1 in science in high school. If the Chinese are better at teaching and getting results, why wouldn’t we hire them (outsource) to discipline and teach our children. Would it rock your world that the old lesson plan might be subject to competition? Teaching is a state monopoly in it’s current form. Let the public sector experience the same life as the private sector. Scary, isn’t it?

By lol

February 24, 2011 7:52 PM | Link to this

I agree carlos. How is it possible that Kasich hasn’t turned things around yet? He’s been in office at least a month hasn’t he? Where are the results? Funny how the libtards like carlos making posts like this are the same ones saying we need to give Obama a few more years to get things moving. Morons…

By carlos

February 24, 2011 7:39 PM | Link to this

They say the unions are corrupt,they are the ones that should be arrested for conspiricy.Thought Kasich was going to lift Ohio up.Only JOBS he wants to create is $9.00 an hour.What a DuD

By tiredofit!

February 24, 2011 6:52 PM | Link to this

this poll like all polls depends on how you ask the question.

By @things are tough all over?

February 24, 2011 6:39 PM | Link to this

Kasich is not exactly working for free, and neither is his staff: http://www.plunderbund.com/2011/01/06/governors-office-salaries-going-way-up-under-kasich/. On the contrary, if you would pay attention, you would realize that the top 1% is getting richer while the rest of us experience working poverty. If the unions are so all-powerful, how do so many R’s get elected? After the R Supreme Court’s disastrous campaign financing decision, it is a game of money, which means propaganda. Unions are the working person’s right in maintaining a significant voice in the process. Otherwise the Supreme Court’s decision really does become a one-two punch, doesn’t it? Think, people. Who really represents you, and what standard of living do you want? An upward spiral or a downward spiral. National debt was not a D idea, it was reincurred under W. I do blame Clinton and Obama for not securing social security. People laugh about the “lock box” idea, but it was solid, especially in retrospect.

By Things are tough all over.

February 24, 2011 6:20 PM | Link to this

taxpayer/consumer/voter, It is an even sadder day when 50k plus health care, pensions, and sick days far exceeds the median income/benefits of many of the communities these people are employed by…. Public sector union members help choose who they negotiate with. Teacher unions ,through large campaign contributions, have tremendous influence over who gets elected to bargain with them. Any time charter schools are considered, the unions rally to protect their monopoly in the name of the children. Michelle Rhee’s attempts to reform the DC school district were rebuffed at the ballot box by union money that wanted a return to the status quo. “Seniority is the holy grail of unions.” Michelle Rhee

By Greed has killed us

February 24, 2011 5:43 PM | Link to this

It all boils down to greed. It appears our society has gotten lazy and greedy. Everyone only wants to work to 55 and then continue to receive a paycheck (pension) and health benefits for the rest of their life. This is why we are in this mess. You simply cannot pay someone to stay home and be unproductive. I’ve been on both sides, an employee and an employer. I received a salary for the work I did and that was all. when I stopped working, I stopped getting paid. Now, when hiring someone, they want to work for a while and then stay home but have me continue to pay them to stay home. Oh and pay their medical bills too. that is like hiring and paying 5 people but only 2 of them stay and actually work. Everyone with pensions think their money is in a big box safely tucked away for them to draw out of. Wake up, there is no money. What little pension you paid into, you have already drawed back plus much more. Who picks up the difference? The private sector, non-union middle class tax payers.

By hah

February 24, 2011 5:09 PM | Link to this

“I DON’T want just anyone teaching my kids” Apparently it is too late for that.

By taxpayer/consumer/voter

February 24, 2011 4:55 PM | Link to this

“My tax dollars” boo hoo hoo. Stop acting like these people are second class citizens. On the contrary, the R’s see them as symbolic of toppling the American middle class. Money is money is money, whether it’s collected in taxes, charged for a good or service, or cut off from you when you are downsized or divested of your pension. Republican propaganda has you completely blinded to the larger picture. Unionization and budgetary concerns are two separate issues. These unions have been making concessions, as everyone has. There is no connection between busting the unions and saving money. If anything, the government is deprived of an established system for talking to these professions about everything, and the citizenry is deprived of their collective expertise. This is conservative mudslinging, plain and simple. It is anti-productive, especially since the USA is behind in educational standards. VP Biden if not P Obama should be showing support for these unions, especially if they expect to carry the states in two years. Distort the economy? Have you seen the statistics on the growing wealth/poverty gap in this country? I DON’T want just anyone teaching my kids, and you shouldn’t either. They are the future doctors, business people, workers, and leaders of tomorrow. It is a sad statement when 50K, healthcare, pension, and sick days for professional work are considered an extravagant income.

By Retired Sgt

February 24, 2011 4:52 PM | Link to this

@union logic: Once again, you are not required to become a member of the FOP/IAFF, unlike a Private Union where membership is required to work the job. The FOP, the official bargaining entity for classified sworn police members, will still bargain on your behalf. The fair dues checkoff can go to whatever charity that you desire, but it ensures that you are still contributing the same amount as those that are members of the FOP/IAFF. You can not do this in a “UNION.”

By Union Logic?

February 24, 2011 4:39 PM | Link to this

SGT said: The term “UNION” is a misnomer as the FOP/IAFF are “FRATERNAL” organizations whose membership is not required. This is just one of the many differences between the traditional “Union” and us. If you are not a member of the FOP/IAFF, there is a fair dues checkoff in the same amount of what the dues would be…….Does that mean you don’t HAVE to belong to the Union, but by Golly, you can’t have the money, you have to pay it anyway? Where does the money from the “fair dues” checkoff go? Sounds like a typical union scam to me! Am I missing something? If you OPT out of the IAFF/FOP you should not have ONE CENT taken from your check.

By Just the Facts

February 24, 2011 4:23 PM | Link to this

In simpler terms Sarge, if you and I were standing in line at Taco Bell, and I gave you five dollars to buy your meal, and I bought my own meal, would you really argue that you paid your own way since you simply transferred the funds from one hand to another? Either way, I would have paid for both meals. It really is that simple. ALSO, I don’t mean to imply that the services provided by the Public Sector aren’t necessary and good, only that the funding really isn’t debatable.

By I M Taxpayer

February 24, 2011 4:18 PM | Link to this

The sgt has nailed it right on the head. Nice job!

By Just the Facts

February 24, 2011 4:18 PM | Link to this

Sarge, I agree with most of what you said, except, “You tend to forget that Public Employees are taxpayers TOO, so they are also contributing to their own wages and benefits yet again.” You’re wrong on this one. Public sector services typically only provide “services”, they don’t sell tangible goods, therefore the really don’t generate any revenue to speak of. The entirety of their check comes from the Private Sector’s taxes. To say that they also pay taxes is ridiculous. It would probably be cheaper for all of us if we didn’t make them pay ANY taxes, and we just reduced their pay equitably so that their AGI doesn’t change. Then we wouldn’t have to give them more of OUR tax money to cover their tax burden. Kind of a circle jerk, isn’t it?

By Retired Sgt

February 24, 2011 4:01 PM | Link to this

Squirrelly, Once again, public employees DO contribute to their pensions. (Currently it is 10% of GROSS pay, soon it will be 12.5%). Public Employees DO contribute to their HC Plans, always have, but are now paying more toward it. (about $150/pp). COD employees (As well as most public employees throughout the state) have taken pay freezes, as well as furlough days (amounting to 1 weeks pay) so, they have taken CUT in all phases, (Pay, HC, and Pension contributions increased). You tend to forget that Public Employees are taxpayers TOO, so they are also contributing to their own wages and benefits yet again. You also are apparently unable to seperate PRIVATE unions from PUBLIC unions, and grasping the concept that they are DIFFERENT in makeup and abilities.

By Squirrellygirl

February 24, 2011 3:41 PM | Link to this

I know that my insurance premium went from $40/pay period to $150/pay period, so I had to elect to get an inferior insurance because it would have eaten my entire raise, which is why I even changed jobs and accepted this current position. I think it is only fair that public employees also have their contributions increased to look more like the private sector. Same for pension contributions. I appreciate the public workers and we all know we need their support; however, they should not be contributing less to their benefits that those that are paying their paychecks…which is all taxpayers. Without the private sector, there would be no salaries for public workers. Just remember that. And unions are not as useful as they once were, and are now dragging our economy down because of the increase in cost of goods/services. Hopefully, Kasich will be able to lower the taxes and bring in more businesses that will hire and make our unemployment rate go down. Then there will be more people paying taxes and this will help pay off the deficit that was created under Strickland’s watch. I wish all the best to the private and public sectors, but the unions are dirty and they have to go. Our current administration (Obama) cannot force people to belong to unions. Our government should not require people to belong to unions before they are allowed to accept their contracts. Hopefully, Kasich will be able to fix that in our state, too. I think Kasich is doing what the voters elected him to do. The bullying tactics of the unions must be highlighted and put down. The media is partially to blame for the misrepresentation of how the unions have been behaving, the language they are using. It’s really getting kind of scary.

By firefighter

February 24, 2011 2:15 PM | Link to this

Thanks sgt for explaining the truth. People also forget an important which is never talked about. fact finders come before arbitration. They have the power to mediate and usually come up with proposals that are satisfactory to both sides. Most contracts never go to an arbitrator who has to side with one side or the other.

By Navin Johnson

February 24, 2011 1:30 PM | Link to this

Retired Sgt. Thanks for the information. I appreciate you taking the time.

By Retired Sgt

February 24, 2011 12:55 PM | Link to this

@Navin: I will try to answer the majority of your questions. #1-Police/Fire haven’t lumped themselves in with the other city unions, but their concern is the same, because the C/B Bill affects ALL Government employees. I guess that is why you consider them lumped in with the other Unions. #2-Union dues. Members of the FOP/IAFF are not required to pay dues, but their interests are still represented for them in collective bargaining matters by the FOP/IAFF who are consideered the chief bargaining units for those groups. The term “UNION” is a misnomer as the FOP/IAFF are “FRATERNAL” organizations whose membership is not required. This is just one of the many differences between the traditional “Union” and us. If you are not a member of the FOP/IAFF, there is a fair dues checkoff in the same amount of what the dues would be. I am not sure what it is now, but I believe it is around $100/mo. ($50.00/pay). #3-Political donations. The FOP endorses candidates, but I can’t recall ever giving money to any political candidate. #4-How many people are employed by the “Union”-the majority of the classified rank and file, from Officer to LT. are represented. (That would be around 350 members of the DPD). #5-Concessions.- All members of the classified bargaining unit have made concessions for the past 5 years. Those include pay freezes, furlough days (Amounting to the equivelant of a weeks pay),and increase in HC Premiums. #6-Attornies employed.- I cant speak for the IAFF on this one, but the FOP does employ a law firm to represent them and the interests of the bargaining unit, and pays for that service out of collected dues. They also provide a “Legal Defense Fund” at a cost to the individual member, for additional legal services rendered as a result of job related actions. Again, Collective bargaining is a PROCESS, A process of ensuring that everyone is on a fair and level playing field. Public service employees are prohibited form job actions, unlike their private union counterparts. C/B is the only way to ensure everyones interests are secured. C/B need not be abolished, it just needs revamped allowing the Arbitor greater range of structuring the deal, instead of ruling for one or the other. I also feel it is unfair to blame public employees for Ohio’s financial woes. There is enough waste at the state level, including extending unemployment bennies for 2 years, welfare, medicaid, and all the freebies people who dont want to work get. Public employees throughout the state have made many concessions over the past several years. finally, pblic employees in this state contribute 10% (soon 12.5%) of their GROSS pay each pay period into the pension plan. Additionally, they pay taxes too, making them taxpayers also. A fact lost in this conversation.

By Sue

February 24, 2011 12:48 PM | Link to this

Gotta love people who hated their teachers in school. It is coming through loud and clear. But that shouldn’t cloud this issue. Those of us old enough to remember when teachers were “good” and knew what they were doing all remember those kids in our classes who couldn’t pass a test, slept through class, slipped out the side door for a smoke of that funny stuff or never bothered to come at all. Now, some of you think teachers should be able to teach anyone- that’s their job. But if you are honest everyone of you has had situations where you couldn’t complete a task no matter how hard you tried. You knew you were well qualified but something about the task made it impossible to succeed. Well, teachers go through that on a daily basis. Marisa’s dad played Russian roulette with a bb gun last night, with her as the target and she got hit and the bullet is still in her hand. She just doesn’t feel like working today. Danny’s mom put him in the hospital last week and he just was put in foster care and is in the 11th foster home. Steven’s dad just got sentenced to life, mom is already in jail and now he has to go live with Grandma-again. Jimmy was playing with a gun the other night and accidentally killed his little brother. Jack just moved here from a foreign country. He speaks some English so his family thinks he’s fluent. He’s not. Angel just returned to school after being shot in a drive-by. All of these stories are real. The names have been changed. And you think “a good teacher should be able to reach anyone”. Yeah, right.

By Retired Sgt

February 24, 2011 12:16 PM | Link to this

@Bob: FYI, NAFTA was signed into law on December 8, 1993 under President Bill Clinton and a Democratic controlled House and Senate. The Republicans did not take control of the House until January, 1995. As for the Poll, polls are like A holes, everyone has one. I also think most people are confused what Collective barganing is. It is a process to evaluate the proposed plans of both management (the Government) and Workers (The public employees). Unfortunately, under the current structure, the Arbitor has no ability to restructure plans and rule. They must ONLY rule on which plan is most fair. collective Bargaining need not be dismantled, it mearly need to be restructured so the Arbitor has a better ability to make the BEST plan out of what they have had brought before them.

By Mike R

February 24, 2011 12:02 PM | Link to this

Jim, that pay is for actual work. I’m sure if the State didn’t pay the ACLU would be suing and that would cost more in lawyer costs. I’m not sure, but will presume, the OPI actually turns a profit. After all, the hourly rate starts out at .21 cents/hour with a mxaimum pay rate of $1.23/hour. Certainly China can’t produce and ship license plates cheaper than that to Ohio!

By KCM

February 24, 2011 11:58 AM | Link to this

@Jammin- I completely agree with you. My posts were in regards to basing merit pay soley on test scores. However, if the state wants to save money by going to merit pay they will have to pay someone else to figure out the merit pay of each teacher. I don’t think this should be implemented for every teacher right away though. There needs to be a testing period to make sure it works. I am a soon to be teacher (just graduated) and have seen teachers change students lives.

By tiredofit!

February 24, 2011 11:53 AM | Link to this

george bush ruined the american economy. put 2 wars on our credit card. and the republicans blame working people for the problem. our state workers did not make this mess. why beat them over the head for it.

By hey judi

February 24, 2011 11:35 AM | Link to this

The grownups are trying to talk, go play in your room until we’re done if you don’t have anything intelligent to add.

By jeez

February 24, 2011 11:16 AM | Link to this

JD’s post from February 23, 2011 10:06 PM is flat out embarrassing. No wonder Johnny can’t read if these are the ‘teachers’. How can a teacher not know the proper use of “their”, “there”, and “they’re”? Yet somehow they were all misused by one teacher in one post. If only that wasn’t the only issue. Flat out embarrassing without even bringing up the pathetic attitude and whining.

By Jim

February 24, 2011 11:08 AM | Link to this

Maybe the state could stop paying the 50,000 plus inmates in Ohio. Why are we paying them each $18.00 a month to be locked up. Lets see, they get free medical care,free meals and a wage for being a menace to society.Do the cuts to them governor instead of state employees that have to deal with these convicts moans and groans how its not fair how their being treated.

By Mike R

February 24, 2011 11:00 AM | Link to this

So, what are you saying, Judi, you’re against freedom of speech? That others aren’t entitled to express their opinion? Of course, that would make sense if you do. After all, you only get and base your comments from info off the Daily Kos. One of the most hate-filled, vile, web sites out there. @bob—Please do some research before posting. “The Bush economy was based on unneeded housing starts??” Get real. Why was there a housing bubble? See Barney Frank and Senator Dodd and their legislation passed in the late ‘90’s that promoted Alt-A and sub-prime loans to unworthy borrowers via Freddie and Fannie.

By Navin Johnson

February 24, 2011 10:39 AM | Link to this

City of Dayton Emp….I’ve have always wondered why Police and Fire employees are mixed in with all employees when it comes to union representation. I beleive, based on the type of work they perform, the requirements and expectations of those employees, it just doesn’t make good sense. But when you have lumped yourselves all together, you have to be treated as one entity. That is the way the unions wanted it. So, Its pointless to claim since you perform these special services, you should be treated differently. You state all you have given up, but let me ask you something? How much are your union dues?, how much $ does your union give out in political donations? How many people are employed by your union? Did those they make any concessions? How many attorneys do they employ? If you have accepted concessions, without asking these questions from your union, you really shouldn’t expect the average taxpayer to pay higher and higher taxes to close the gap. Enlighten me with facts. I have the upmost respect for Police and Fire personnel, and these are things I wonder about. Enlighten me with the real truth, not just a point of view.

By City of Dayton Employees

February 24, 2011 10:00 AM | Link to this

again, I would like to point out that City of Dayton UNION members have been making cuts and working with the city for the last 5 YEARS. No pay raises or cost of living raises, 5 furlough days(pay cut), Health insurance has gone from $40 a month to over $200, and most departments have been cut over 25% in manpower(over 600 postiions city wide), but still getting the job done(barely). These are facts, look at the police, fire and DPSU contracts for the last 5 years. The cuts are in there, plain as day. For all of you who says the unions need to make changes, we have been, for years. Get the facts before you say its a gravy train. After the least round of contract negotiations, the NON UNION CITY OFFICIALS gave themselves raises, on the CUTS the unions gave back. This is why collective bargaining is needed for police and fire, because BY LAW they cannot strike, therefore they would have absolutely no recourse. The NON UNION officials are the ones who hold the money and give it to themselves, after saying to the rest of the world they are broke! Stop all the wasteful spending, and then lets see where we are at. The unions have been and continue to make concessions, we just want a voice in the matter and an IMPARTIAL resolution when there is no agreement. This is called BINDING ARBITRATION.

By Perspective

February 24, 2011 9:46 AM | Link to this

@bob I beg to differ with you sir.The hate campaign against Bush began at the end of 2000 when Al Gore lost the election.It continued on until the present day where you yourself continue it.

By Judi

February 24, 2011 9:27 AM | Link to this

I see the lazy DDN has left this post up so that the restless RWs can exercise their fingers writing comments that make absolutely NO sense when compared with the reality of what is going on this country today. Keep on watching FOX, supporting the GOP and watch your future go right down the drain.

By bob

February 24, 2011 9:26 AM | Link to this

Bush’s “economy” was based on unneeded housing starts and a ghost hunt for WMD’s.At least Democrats gave him 6 YEARS before we judged him,unlike the 6 MONTHS you gave Obama.The unneeded housing starts were then attacked by the Republicans as “loose credit:”——AFTER Bush was out,atypical.He then gave the first Tarp money to the banks-the guys that started it all.Transparency in government is a pipedream under Republican rule

By Jammin

February 24, 2011 9:24 AM | Link to this

Wow, it appears that those claiming to be teachers throughout this blog are the WORST when it comes to spelling and typing coherent sentences. And you wonder why you don’t have the respect you want? I am a teacher, by the way. There IS a way to have merit pay that works—it would have to be based on a very complicated formula, only a small part of which should be student test scores. Yes, it IS hard to teach students with a poor background or a family without a value for education. THAT is a cultural problem that would solve a lot in this country (whole other topic). BUT, there are schools that do this with success (though most are not public schools). Look up “Rice Catholic High SChool” in Harlem or any of the Cristo Rey schools (one of which coming to Cincy next year) and you will see that it IS possible to change the lives of those who appear not to care.

By KCM

February 24, 2011 9:04 AM | Link to this

@Classic…”. The teachers making excuse for why they “can’t” teach certain children are particularly pathetic. Teaching ALL of your children is your job, so you need to be doing whatever it takes to teach ALL of them, NO EXCUSES.” If teachers are being held to that standard than doctor’s should have no excuses to not being able to treat a terminally ill patient. It is a doctor’s job to save lives so they don’t have an excuse if a patient dies. Or if a patient who has high cholesterol comes in and doesn’t get his cholesterol down because he isn’t eating right then the Doctor should be help accountable. (This is NOT attacking doctors. Just an example of how ridiculous you sound to me).

By bob

February 24, 2011 9:00 AM | Link to this

The fact remains that NAFTA was designed,written and endorsed by REPUBLICANS.Give Clinton credit,although he could have stalled it,he was dealing with a majority Republican house and senate.Unlike Boehner,he let government WORK and he has more in his vocabulary than “No No No”

By Perspective

February 24, 2011 8:55 AM | Link to this

JD and bull,you both need some remedial English classes along with your continuing education it seems.May I suggest spellcheck in the future. It’s hard to believe you’re teachers when there are so many grammatical errors in your posts. Those of you bringing up NAFTA,Bill Clinton signed it into law,not a Republican.

By Bob the Retard

February 24, 2011 8:42 AM | Link to this

Bob, Bush had an unprecedented 52 consecutive months of economic growth and HE ran your portfolio to an all time high. Nice try. Stick to the topic. Your portfolio took a nose dive when Nancy Pelosi took over the House of Reps. Buy a vowel or something.

By Squirrellygirl

February 24, 2011 8:37 AM | Link to this

U at 5:54, you sound jealous of me. You want to change the subject? The fact is, voters voiced their opinions last election, and we want something done about the overregulation and overspending and overintrusive government that hasn’t been doing its job but has managed to poke into every detail of our lives increasing our taxes to pay for their pokes! The nature of my job is that most of the time I work via a contract, and sometimes that contract can be renewed for 5 years, and sometimes it is renewed for 1 year, and sometimes it isn’t renewed and you find another job. You apparently don’t understand how that worked, so I thought I’d educate you so you don’t speak so ignorantly next time. I won’t compare my education but I can tell you that I’ve worked all of my life since I was 16 years old, and I’ve paid taxes and paid into Social Security. I am currently a single taxpayer who pays more than my share because of some entitlements that are available for special interest groups and special tax breaks for families, and for the extra stimulus waste like cars for klunkers programs and the one where you could purchase brand new “energy saving” appliances with a big discount from the government (a “thank you” to the tax payers would be nice) or some of the homeowners who purchased homes that couldn’t afford them got bailed out and where my money was sent to China for jobs, just to name of few of the items for waste. Ohioans have an unfriendly business environment because of extremely high state taxes, which Kasich wants to cut so that we can bring in businesses that will hire people who are currently on unemployment, which will lower the unemployment rate in Ohio and put people back to work so that they can bring in more taxes and help pay off the deficit that was created under Strickland’s watch. In order to do this, Kasich needs to be able to renegotiate how much public employees will have to contribute for their benefits and pensions. That’s the reason for the bill. Kasich is just doing what he was voted in to do. He’s doing his job. Unions should be voluntary, not mandatory. This is America. God Save America and our economy!

By bob

February 24, 2011 8:24 AM | Link to this

What would Republicans have said about the latest ruling from the Supreme Court on unlimited un-named contributions if that decision was handed down in 1968 with unions in power ? Alas—foul—not fair—I deserve better [ Sound familiar ]We need set rules that EVERYONE abides by ALL THE TIME.But then….where would Republican donations be applied? Under NAFTA,companies left with government’s blessing EVEN THOUGH their pension plans had been under funded or borrowed against to the hilt [ thanks Ronny Republican Reagan ]The government is now stuck with those plans and the next claim by the Rekooks will be that they’re another handout.If a crook takes my money and then gives it back,THAT IS NO HANDOUT

By Navin Johnson

February 24, 2011 8:22 AM | Link to this

Repubs are liars…Bob, if you can say that in spite of the daily news, then you have comprehension issues…Watergate? ..Kent State??..and you’re telling everyone to stop and think? Is this your example of deep thought?

By bob

February 24, 2011 8:08 AM | Link to this

Everyone needs to STOP and THINK—-why is this country in demise ? Union membership has waned to an all-time low and yet we have 10 % unemployment,low wages.It is called THE ABANDONMENT OF THE GOLD STANDARD.Who was responsible ? Richard Nixon-Republican.Seems funny,but every time a Democrat gets elected,my portfolio shoots through the roof,but NEVER under “business-savy” Republicans.Watergate…Kent State…they’re filthy.Now they’re grasping tea-party ideology….except the backing of a buck.AS long as money is backed by nothing other than a political promise,you’d better keep your union…and remember,money may talk…it may swear BUT it doesn’t vote.

By bob

February 24, 2011 7:50 AM | Link to this

Your church is a union,your country is a union,marriage is a union and corporate mergers are unions—only the naive would distinguish the difference.Unions have had no more ill effect on this country than NAFTA…GATT.Who really creates the inflation that a union bargains to keep up with ? You betcha—your politician putting nothing on the market,you are mandated to accept his “services” at an inflated price.Kasich and Boehner ought to practice what THEY preach—a pay cut,health care cut and pension cut,REPUBLICANS ARE PROFESSIONAL LIARS !!!

By An observer

February 24, 2011 7:43 AM | Link to this

A nice post J.D. I will write more later.I usually fill a column.

By nice

February 24, 2011 7:17 AM | Link to this

More whining and crying from a teacher from ‘JD’. By the way ‘JD’, you should have said ‘if you think you can do a better job THAN me’. Nice. You chose to be a teacher, so you deal with the hours. If you don’t like it, find another job. Nothing ‘rich’ about that.

By JD

February 24, 2011 6:59 AM | Link to this

By more February 23, 2011 10:28 PM Come on teachers, let’s hear more excuses why you “can’t” do your job. Maybe if you put half the effort into your job as you do making long-winded online posts, you’d reach some of these students that you seem to have no control over. Since you admit you can’t do your job no matter what, we should replace you with someone who has a better attitude, or at least a plan of some kind. If I don’t do my job, I don’t get to blame others, so why should you? Especially since the ‘others’ in your case IS YOUR JOB. That is rich. IF you think you can do a better job then me. Come on down and see how long you last. I bet you have a 9 to 5 Job which means you get up at a 8. I am up at 5 am and I work unitl about 10 to 10:30 pm grading and planing for the next couple of days then there are the days that I myself go to school at night get home at 9 and still have to grade papers until 1 in the morning. Could you do that I don’t think so and that is why i have the benefits that i have because the union. SO!

By Beldon Revelee

February 24, 2011 6:49 AM | Link to this

Jesse Jackson rallies with Ohio’s Teamsters! Ha Ha! He is there for money, to get to sit at the Democrat table and be right in there with the unions. I support the Wisconsin Governor. This organized labor thing has become a bridge for the liberal and socialist movement even up to the White House. I say, “Stop it in it’s tracks!” Jimmy Hoffa ran the teamsters along with the mob in the mid 1900s. Now we have his son, James Hoffa. Does the apple fall far from the tree? State jobs are paid for by taxes. I don’t want my taxes sucked up by corrupt socialist unions in bed with socialist politicians.

By classic

February 24, 2011 6:48 AM | Link to this

All you union posters are doing yourselves no favors whatsoever. All I hear is whining, crying, and excuses. ‘This isn’t fair, that isn’t fair, nothing is ever my fault, I deserve this, I deserve that, wah, wah, wah, etc.’ It is truly disgusting. The teachers making excuse for why they “can’t” teach certain children are particularly pathetic. Teaching ALL of your children is your job, so you need to be doing whatever it takes to teach ALL of them, NO EXCUSES.

By Cathy

February 24, 2011 5:57 AM | Link to this

Why did you choose to lead this story with the results of the Rasmussen poll?

By Philman

February 24, 2011 5:47 AM | Link to this

NICE TRY jESSE JACKSON,PUBLIC EMPLOYEE UNIONS ARE NOT BEING MADE A SCAPEGOAT, HOW MANY STATE & FEDERAL EMPLOYEES HAVE HAD TO TO A PAY CUT OR HAD THEIR HOURS CUT AT WORK??? I WAS ON 35 HOURS A WEEK FOR 2 YRS, SEEMS TO ME THE PEOPLE THAT WORK FOR ME BEING PAID FOR WITH MY TAX DOLLARS HAVE PRETTY MUCH GONE THRU THIS RECESSION UNSCATHED, IT’S TIME FOR THEM TO FEEL SOME PAIN..STATES ARE ALMOST BANKRUPT, WOULD YOU GREEDY UNION FOLK RATHER LEAVE THIS TO YOUR CHILDREN & GRANDCHILDREN??? THE SYMBIOTIC RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN UNION THUGS & DEMOCRATS IS OVER, 2012 WILL FINNISH THE WORK AMERICA STARTED IN 2010… LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT..

By dlgg

February 24, 2011 5:32 AM | Link to this

Public employees should have the right to collective bargaining and union organizing. However, they should not have the ability to go on strike. And, actually, should be fired if they tried. As PATCO was. There are times and places for union protection and contract talks. In reality, a federal employee can have wage freezes and benefit changes. And, actually, they could even have wage and benefit cuts. Wage freezes happen in the federal sector. It appears as though the union thing is somewhat cyclic in nature. If management and corporate entities become abusive to workers in the future, there could be a return to stronger unions and union protection.

By Clydesplace

February 24, 2011 3:39 AM | Link to this

Oh, the phony Rasmussan poll that was shown to lead to a specific desired poll makes it irrelevant and discredited in the light of the fact that other polls such as Gallup got the opposite result. And the usual right wing sheep mimicking their talking points, I guess I can skip this.

By KCM

February 23, 2011 11:26 PM | Link to this

@Simple- So your solution is to replace qualified and educated workers with people who have no background or experience in the jobs they will be going into?

By KCM

February 23, 2011 11:23 PM | Link to this

@More…Many teachers do their job and do it well. But what if a teacher has a student who comes in the day of the OAA after visiting her mother who abused her? What about the student who developmentally is not ready to take the test? What about the student who comes without having breakfast? What about the student who comes in who has never seen a book before? I could go on, but there are so many factors teachers have NO control over that affect student performance. Yet those students could show tremendous growth throughout the year, but if they don’t do well on the test then it isn’t good enough. Not all districts and schools will be like this because the student population differs between districts. It’s not the students themselves teachers have no control over its the factors and environments children come from.

By simple answer

February 23, 2011 11:15 PM | Link to this

What is so hard to understand about this situation? If the public workers don’t want to work for the wages we dictate, fire them. With a 10+% unemployment rate there is an abundance of workers to replace them. With all the GM, construction, retail workers, realtors, and laborers laid off, there is an abundance of people to step right inand teach our kids, police our streets, put out our fires and nurse our sick. My kid needs a job…he has worked retail and has taken courses at a Community College so he is just as qualified to be a teacher or cop or nurse as any of these whiny incumbents. And he would do it for significantly less! C’mon people why do you continue to pay for filet mignon when you can buy bologna?

By more

February 23, 2011 10:28 PM | Link to this

Come on teachers, let’s hear more excuses why you “can’t” do your job. Maybe if you put half the effort into your job as you do making long-winded online posts, you’d reach some of these students that you seem to have no control over. Since you admit you can’t do your job no matter what, we should replace you with someone who has a better attitude, or at least a plan of some kind. If I don’t do my job, I don’t get to blame others, so why should you? Especially since the ‘others’ in your case IS YOUR JOB.

By JD

February 23, 2011 10:11 PM | Link to this

WOW! How stupid are you? Do you think a real teacher would post something like that? Come on wake-up! No wonder you make less. You are not educated enought to get a high paying job with good benefits!

By JD

February 23, 2011 10:06 PM | Link to this

I think the fact that these union employees are so afraid to be judged/paid based on their performance and not some ridiculous union nonsense pretty much says it all. When it come to teaching performance and paying them based on student performance is unfair all together. I can’t say anything about state workers. However, when it comes to teaching. Students make their own choices and I, as a teacher can do nothing about it. They choose to study or not. They choose to do homework or not. They choose,I can’t get on the bus with every student that I teach and make sure that they are doing their work at home so that they can master the materal. All I can do is give then the information. Show then how to completed it and do it correctly and then it is up to them and you want to pay me base on what they choose to learn or not learn. That is BS. The rich stay rich because they want to be educated. So that they can keep what they have or gain more for themselves and their family. Right now I am teaching a group of students who chould careless about their education. All they want to do is get drunk, high and have sex. You might say call their parents. That’s funny. I done that alot this year the most I have every done or needed too. You know what kind of response I got from most of my parents is. I can’t do anything with them either and it all the school fault. Nice! How about this if their parents where educated and not on drugs and drinking every night maybe their kids would care about their education too, but now days to many don’t and it up to the teachers to be their mommy and daddy. In stead the government gives them a free check at the end of the month and some get two one for the family then and a ssi check for their kid. You never see them on report card night or IEP meeting as long as the check keep showing up every month their good. However, once the check stop their in the build and asking for their son or daughter to be tested so that they can be place on AN IEP so that they can get that check. This is why teachers have unions to help them keep their jobs and to earn a good wage and benefits because if their wasn’t teachers in my school district would be out of their jobs in two to three years because we are never going to meet AYP. The teachers are doing their jobs everyday. It is just more important for our students to get high,drunk and have kids by 15 then it is getting a good educaiton and earning a living. Knowing that they can ink out a living just like mom and dad, they to can get free money for the government. So you what to pay me base on students who DON’t Care is just not right and that is why teachers have the unions to fight for them. END OF STORY!

By Koch Brothers

February 23, 2011 10:04 PM | Link to this

To typical: Attaboy - We love your smokescreen! We thank you for making folks think our solution appears as “lib talking points”. You are truly a good soldier. We have promoted you to Private First Class, with a salary of $22k/yr and we will notify you when we feel you deserve a raise. Once we are successful in eliminating the middle class and establish the $10-15/hr wage as the career goal of all US workers, we can work together to strip them of all “entitlements” such as Social Security and Medicaire. Then our brothers in the health care industry will be fully able to achieve their goals of unfetterred wealth. Cost is not nearly as important as profit so keep up the good work denigrating those we oppose. Remember, education is not important in this country (so crucify the teachers) as long as we can outsource our labor offshore for a fraction of the cost. By the way, please contribute to our PAC to help us implement our vision.

By HKettlehake

February 23, 2011 10:00 PM | Link to this

Union members weren’t worrried about the Administration’s efforts to “spread the wealth” until THEIR wealth came into focus

By typical

February 23, 2011 9:50 PM | Link to this

Oh listen to those poor public workers. They haven’t had a raise in YEARS. They have to pay more for health insurance (even though their ‘more’ is way less than most of us). They have to pay for more of their retirement (see comment on health insurance). Guess what. Most of us in the real world would LOVE to have it that bad. We’re taking REAL pay cuts, or losing our jobs altogether. We were already paying much more than you for insurance, and now we’re paying even more. Most of us don’t even have a pension and have to save a much higher portion of our earnings to even come close to what you’ll get from the taxpayers in retirement. But that’s okay, you keep up the pity party. I’m sure there are plenty of like-minded libtards out there feeling sorry for your ‘plight’.

By public educ teacher

February 23, 2011 8:32 PM | Link to this

I am evaluated, but don’t tie everything I do based on how students do on a test ~ esp if a teacher is working in a district where most of the kids aren’t even ready for kdg on the first day they walk into a school. When I read the opposition to what public employees have, I see a lot of misinformation. Teachers are not taking raises, they are paying more for health care. The rest of it - it is up for negotiation. It is the ability to come to the table and explain where each side is coming from and compromise. I am proud that my district has been able to do that.

By there you have it...

February 23, 2011 8:26 PM | Link to this

karon is still clueless.

By karon

February 23, 2011 8:24 PM | Link to this

RM, yes I still support trains and I will always support them! Dont worry Kasich office hears from me also Mike Turner office! Right now I am working on trying to get the german company Siemens to come to the Cincinnati and Dayton area to do an expo about high speed passenger trains! They educate the public about this wonderful alternative type of transportation!

By rm miamisburg

February 23, 2011 8:08 PM | Link to this

While we are now talking about this matter, it has come to my attention ONE voice is missing.. WHAT you have not noticed it? No Trains,No High Speed Rail remarks. KARON.. You still out there.. Bueller, Bueller, Bueller..

By tvwohio

February 23, 2011 7:45 PM | Link to this

The problem is this country is broke. Those of us in Industry have been paying for health care and retirement for most of our life. Public Servants are not servants anymore but trying to be masters. What’s most important keeping a job or having it eliminated because there isn’t enough money. Taxing isn’t the answer look how many jobs have been lost to other states and countries. Now the Unions have to put up, shut up or lose their jobs like the +9% which is probably closer to 17% if you factor in those who gave up. Get real guys, you chose your profession and maybe a career change is in order. t

By reality

February 23, 2011 7:39 PM | Link to this

I think the fact that these union employees are so afraid to be judged/paid based on their performance and not some ridiculous union nonsense pretty much says it all. It isn’t so scary out here in the real world with the rest of us, you’ll adapt. Or if not, I guess you’ll starve… Oh well, you’ll only have yourself to blame if that happens.

By hmmm...

February 23, 2011 7:28 PM | Link to this

Anyone else find it ironic how so many of the pro-union posts make excellent anti-union arguments. If only they were smart enough to realize it.

By typical

February 23, 2011 7:25 PM | Link to this

geniuses like the poster ‘Koch Brothers’ are always the problem and never the solution. Excellent job at hitting most of the lib talking points on this subject, now go do some independent research and discover how stupid your post really is…

By DaytonBorn

February 23, 2011 7:11 PM | Link to this

I certainly hope the “teacher” that disagrees with merit pay is not actually a teacher. The punctuation and grammar is atrocious. If this person is actually a teacher, this would be reason collective bargaining needs to be suspended. Unions prevent incompetence from being eliminated!

By Koch Brothers

February 23, 2011 7:06 PM | Link to this

We want to thank all of our cheerleaders helping us win the race to the bottom. We surely couldn’t do it without your help. Remember, decent pay and benefits for cops, firemen, and teachers is bad. Outrageous pay for Wall Streeters and CEOs is good! $60K is way too much to pay a teacher or a cop but $6M is barely adequate for a stockbroker or an energy executive. After all, it is extremely demanding to unearth all those loopholes, tax evasions and fraudulent investment packages that helps us move your pensions and nest eggs into our own personal Easter baskets. We thank you for helping us to dramatically reduce unions in the private sector and drive everyone’s waages to the $10/hr range. We salute you from our yachts. Now on to the public sector. Once we are able, with your devoted help, to reduce public labor rates to a low enough level we can then move in and privatize it at a tremendous windfall. This makes us giddy with anticipation. And we owe it all to you. Our investment in the Tea Party is already beginning to pay dividends. Pay no attention to those Commie Lefties arguing for decent wages. Remember, you lost yours…time for them to lose theirs. We LUV this country!!!

By WOW

February 23, 2011 7:06 PM | Link to this

I sincerely hope ‘bull’ is not really a teacher either. NICE spelling and grammar there ‘teach’. Unreal…

By bull

February 23, 2011 7:05 PM | Link to this

By boo hoo February 23, 2011 6:39 PM So you’re crying because you’re have to pay 10% instead of 5%, even though those of us in the real world average paying around 25%. Poor babies. That is because you have no say! I do and because I have the backing of the union and I get a good contract and benfits. Either you take what they offer or you go find another job if you can and from what I read in the paper there is not much out there. So go cry to your boss for a better deal and watch him laught in your face.

By Hyden Kash

February 23, 2011 7:00 PM | Link to this

Unions have served a good purpose in history. Unfortunately, liberals, politicians, socialists and mobsters have jumped into the picture with unions and made them a bad thing. Teachers make a pretty decent living as well as other public employees. We all have had to sacrifice because of the economy. Now is not the time for raises until we get things into perspective. Big business should sacrifice and bring some jobs back to America. We do need to look at productivity, new technology and see how we can be an asset to big business. I believe in taking care of America first! Obama wants to take away borders as though he could eventually be President of the world. I don’t want our government to tell society how to live. “We the people” must keep our government under control! Bottom line, I am in support of Governors working to back unions down.

By wow

February 23, 2011 6:57 PM | Link to this

I honestly hope you are NOT a real teacher. No one can possibly be dumb enough to think that anyone relies solely on social security for retirement in the same way public employees look to their pensions. I guarantee I would have to put away SIGNIFICANTLY more than 10% ON TOP OF social security to come out with retirement income anywhere near what public employees get for their 10%.

By bull

February 23, 2011 6:57 PM | Link to this

MERIT pay that is such a joke and BS. I am tried of hereing that teachers should be pay base on student performance. I as a teacher can’t go home with each of my students and make sure that they study and do their homework that is their PARENTS JOB NOT MINE. I have straight “A” students who can not pass the OGT and you union haters believe i should lose my job because of this. that is such crap. Then we need to set standards for all workers of this country. If a doctor loses five individuals then he loses his job. If a account lost is late twice with a report he or she is also fired. One another thing and it is a big thing and that UNION Do not keep everyone who is in the union employed get that out of your head. THE UNION make sure that we get a fair contract and that employers can’t go on fire spree just because the want too they have to have a good reason to fire someone. If there wasn’t a union teachers and state employies would be work for peanuts and nothing else because they do not get thre respect of other jobs because it is “so easy to be a teacher and anyone can push a broom around. I would like to see any of you out who are not in a union come a teach a class of 20 to 30 student who give a rats a*s about you.

By not quite

February 23, 2011 6:54 PM | Link to this

You pay LESS for retirement, so you shouldn’t be crying in the first place. And don’t worry about me, I went to school, have a good job, etc. And if I don’t like my situation, I find another one, I don’t cry to a union to ‘make it better’ for me.

By lol

February 23, 2011 6:52 PM | Link to this

oops, that should be larger than your 10% obviously.

By public educ teacher

February 23, 2011 6:51 PM | Link to this

I’m not crying because I pay more for my retirement-that’s one reason why I teach-better retirement. And i spend alot of time maintaining the educ required to teach kids that many wouldn’t want to teach. If you want those benefits, go to school, get what you need to land those jobs w/ these benefits. We know things have to change, but there are somethings that suits sitting in city mgr positions, boards of educ offices that have no clue what is needed-they’re just looking at the bottom line.

By lol

February 23, 2011 6:49 PM | Link to this

What we pay into social security is only a FRACTION of what we pay into retirement (assuming we’re smart). We have to also contribute to our 401k, IRA, etc. and amount, that when combined with SS, will easily be smaller than your 10%. If you don’t like your job, find another one. Don’t expect us to shower you with perks because you think you’re entitled to it for you ‘sacrifice’.

By public educ teacher

February 23, 2011 6:45 PM | Link to this

So, what would you like us to do to suffer with you? My insurance is cheaper because I belong to a larger group. I AM paying 20% of my insurance & realize that will be higher. I pay 10% of my own retirement-folks who pay into SS only pay 6%. That will go up to 15%. Do you want your job/career based on a student who doesn’t want to be in school? No pencils, no paper. &who’s going to protect me when that parent sues me because they think I did something to their kid? Tie test scores to my pay, you’re going to have teachers fighting for only the “good” kids. And in urban districts, how many will take on that mission?

By boo hoo

February 23, 2011 6:39 PM | Link to this

So you’re crying because you’re have to pay 10% instead of 5%, even though those of us in the real world average paying around 25%. Poor babies.

By bsmith

February 23, 2011 6:34 PM | Link to this

By Jack February 23, 2011 4:31 PM who has told teachers that their salary will be cut? Can someone post a link or something. I keep hearing this argument, but there is no evidence. Please, no evidence did you even go to school. Here is the evidence and lesson of the day. IF sign a contract that ask you to pay 10% of you heatlh care which come from you pay check and last year you payed only 5% and you don’t get a raise to cover that increase. Then that is a pay cut because it coming out of my take home pay.

By boo hoo

February 23, 2011 6:24 PM | Link to this

So basically what I’m getting from the union/pro-union posters is that they are horrified at the prospect of having to work under the SAME CONDITIONS AS EVERYONE IN THE REAL WORLD. I suppose for many of you it will be quite a shock to actually have to EARN your paycheck and actually PERFORM to keep your job and/or get raises.

By poor pitiful me

February 23, 2011 5:54 PM | Link to this

Squirrellygirl,you are the posterchild for the anti-union movement. No education, can’t keep a job, can’t find another before spending your savings and retirement account, then not qualified to be hired at a level to provide you with adequate benefits. Then have the unmitigated gall to complain that highly educated career professionals are paid more than you. A typical case of “I can’t, so noone else should”. Exactly the kind of person I want in a position ensuring my drinking water is safe, my soil is not contaminated, my streets are safe and protected against fire, my medical emergencies are treated properly or my kids are educated. NOT!!! Had you planned your own life better you might not be so jealous of those that did. You obviously spend waaaay too much time online, watching Beck and fox, or in Sports and Spirits. Sometimes Karma just $ucks though it still makes accepting personal responsibility somewhat distasteful!!

By please read the bill

February 23, 2011 5:36 PM | Link to this

Please read this bill. There is so much more in the 475 pages that noone has even touched on. Look down in the pages on health care. this will force local goverments to join a plan created by the state. this will give 1 plan for all state, county, and local goverments. How much is that going to cost and where is it coming from. The if you look at the bill thru clear eyes and take the sides out of it it created more layers of goverment. If we truely want to balance the budgets of the stated lets trim it down. Lets work on bills that make sence for all parties involved. Lets look at every contract, not just the workers, but the overpriced contracts to third parties that provide other services. I think if we get the faces out of the budget game we can turn this around

By blamegame

February 23, 2011 5:16 PM | Link to this

The unions did not cause the problems with budget shortfalls and if think busting the unions with solve the problem then you are sadly mistaken.

By hardworker

February 23, 2011 5:02 PM | Link to this

if you are an un-educated factory worker then you dont deserve “middle class” status. So you threaten your employer to pay more and more or you will go on strike. The union have killed this country. Companies must be kept in check but you have created your own monster…so deal with it

By theshawn

February 23, 2011 4:45 PM | Link to this

MW—”@Squirrellygirl, public employees are taxpayers, too. We pay into the same coffers that in turn pay us. So essentially we are paying our own salaries and benefits by paying our taxes.”— Oh my gosh you can’t be serious…. Please take an economics class in the near future. Your taxes do not pay near enough to pay your salary and 20-30+ years in benefits on top of everything else income taxes pay for. I think it’s greedy and sad to believe you should get paid salary and benefits for 60 yrs for only 25-30 yrs of work. This entitlement mentality is killing us.

By ToBurt

February 23, 2011 4:35 PM | Link to this

No, Burt, I meant exactly what I said. Unions have been secretive, bullish…yada yada yada…

By Get Real MW

February 23, 2011 4:34 PM | Link to this

@By MW February 23, 2011 10:20 AM @Squirrellygirl, public employees are taxpayers, too. We pay into the same coffers that in turn pay us. So essentially we are paying our own salaries and benefits by paying our taxes. MW, that might be the dumbest statement in North American History. WHERE does the money come from that pays your salary that you “in turn” pay taxes on? Where? It comes 100% from the private sector. The private sector creates a good or a service and they SELL it for a profit. Some of that money goes to taxes, which PAY YOU. What product do public service employees sell that makes profit? Answer: ZERO. ONLY the private sector generates REAL money. Some of the public sector services are needed and they are GOOD for all of us, but the fact remains they do NOT generate Capital. That doesn’t mean you don’t earn your pay. Don’t read anything into what I’m saying.

By ToBSmith

February 23, 2011 4:33 PM | Link to this

When my contract runs out, it either gets renewed or I have to find another job. That’s life. I never said I was fired. Also, I believe that unions do nothing but screw up our economy. Everything costs more and what exactly are they contributing? They are misusing your pension funds. You happy with that? Anyway, it goes both ways. If the employer doesn’t like you, if you aren’t doing your job, he should be able to let you go. If you don’t like the wages or benefits, you move on. That’s the American way. Unions force employers to hold on to people who don’t do their jobs. Please read my blog carefully, please. I’m not saying that all union members don’t do their jobs. But unions keep costs up and that is what is putting Americans out of jobs. That the job killing bills and overregulation by our current administration.

By Jack

February 23, 2011 4:31 PM | Link to this

who has told teachers that their salary will be cut? Can someone post a link or something. I keep hearing this argument, but there is no evidence. Teachers need to welcome themselves to the real world where accomplishment gets rewarded. If you are not doing your job, there should not be automatic raises, but teachers doing great work will be in a position to demand raises or they will go to a different school district.

By BasedOnMerit

February 23, 2011 4:31 PM | Link to this

BSmith - “Now in the Private sector this happens all the time.” I have worked in the private sector my adult life, and so has all of my family members. Everytime I have not seen “eye to eye” with my bosses I do not feel the need to employ a union to protect me. If my salary and raises are not based off my work performance and MERIT then I can go to another company for another job. Most workers in america DO NOT belong to a union, and they all seem to get along just fine.

By Angry American

February 23, 2011 4:23 PM | Link to this

bsmith says: Squirrellygirl Maybe if you were in a union you would have better pay and health care and be able to keep your job. (that’s probably true whether or not she deserves it. That’s the problem. you can’t fire the sorry arses) bsmith says: Then they can tell you how much money you are going to be pay for your job. (Imagine that, the employer gets to say what they are willing to pay an employee. How novel! Seems like it ALWAYS should have been that way) It seems bsmith is a paid shill of the unions, and as such is not capable of thinking on his own. typical?

By Me

February 23, 2011 4:20 PM | Link to this

In what world are the City of Dayton employees “getting the job done”?? From the parking meter gestapo (sanitation workers who have worked their way to a position of “power”) on down to the public works employees they are a bunch of rude, lazy, ill-mannered fat cats sucking on the public teet. Maybe they don’t get paid much but they sure as hell don’t DO much for that pay. Have you ever had to call about a water bill? Ever had to file a police report for vandalism? How about had questions for someone at the municipal court? I would rather do just about anything than deal with a City of Dayton worker. Now, the City of Beavercreek workers are another story altogether. Call them for something. You get courteous, helpful, well mannered people who speak English (not ebonics) and who go above and beyond to assist you. The last worker in the City of Dayton, please be sure to have someone turn out the lights (Gawd knows you’re either too lazy or incapable.

By Lisa

February 23, 2011 4:20 PM | Link to this

There seems to be an attack on public service workers- you know, the ones who do the jobs no one else wants to do? I mean really, how many of us want to be shot at, run into burning buildings, work with mangled, dying bodies or put up with everyone else’s snotty-attitude brats on a daily basis? Instead, let’s willingly pay high salaries to our selfless politicians and millions to our worthy college coaches. And while we are at it, let’s spend plenty of our hard earned money supporting the multi-millionaire actors, actresses, celebrities and athletes who do so much to improve our lives.

By Ignorance

February 23, 2011 4:20 PM | Link to this

Being ‘protected’ by the union shouldn’t be the primary focus of this argument. If there is open discussion on both parts, then you don’t need a union to control the situation. Good leadership doesn’t have a need for unions. We need to make changes NOW because the state is BROKE. Don’t rely on the gov’t for your financial future (the money won’t be there). Teachers posting: please watch your grammar and spelling. It only confirms for the redneck republicans that you are protected by the union because you shouldn’t be teaching our children in the first place.

By bsmith

February 23, 2011 4:08 PM | Link to this

Squirrellygirl Maybe if you were in a union you would have better pay and heath care and be able to keep your job. Here is the point. If SB5 passes then schools districts can pick and choose who to keep and who to let go for no reason. Then they can tell you how much money you are going to be pay for your job. You would have no right to ask for anything. The school administration would have all the power and you would not be able to do anything about it. Here is an example of what I am talking about. This year you make $50,000 next year they can desided to pay you only $40,000. Now don’t for you still have to pay 20% of your health care. Then the following your they pay only $30,000 you make the statement you can’t do that. They come back at you with take it or leave it. This is what is going to happen with this bill. Ask a teacher in a right to work state and see how much they make and yet those school systems are still in the same problem that we are dealing with here in ohio. Now in the Private sector this happens all the time. You have seen every time you have lost you job becuae you and your boss don’t see EYE TO EYE you are let go. Not the one who come to work and does nothing but yet still has his or her job. So just shut up and join the union!

By Derron

February 23, 2011 3:56 PM | Link to this

Right-So I guess you will boycott union items and support China, India and the like. Sounds to me like you are anti-America anyways.

By LastManstanding

February 23, 2011 3:18 PM | Link to this

Union members, now you’re getting a taste of your own medicine. The voting public is tired of your bullying and ties to the political left. Get over it. Who was it that said, “Elections have consequences?”

By RIGHT

February 23, 2011 3:12 PM | Link to this

The TAXPAYERS NATIONAL BOYCOTT of all UNION GOODS and SERVICES is well underway as of TODAY. We need all TAXPAYERS to join in and show the UNIONS that the AMERICAN TAXPAYER is IN CHARGE. HELP SAVE OUR COUNTRY NOW…

By Shut up Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 3:12 PM | Link to this

Squirrelygirl — The reason you keep getting laid off is because you spend too much time posting your non-sensical, illerate and misspelled diatribes on this board. Get to work!

By RIGHT

February 23, 2011 3:06 PM | Link to this

The TAXPAYERS NATIONAL BOYCOTT of all UNION GOODS and SERVICES is well underway as of TODAY. We need all TAXPAYERS to join in and show the UNIONS that the AMERICAN TAXPAYER is IN CHARGE. HELP SAVE OUR COUNTRY NOW…

By Perspective

February 23, 2011 3:05 PM | Link to this

@Bsmith Where in SB5 does it say you re going to take a 20% pay cut? Have you read it? Or are you just giving the good old union line? Do you make $60k or $30k? Make up your mind. Personally I don’t think you are a teacher.Your grammar and word usage is atrocious. I would hate to think you’re teaching our children.

By Braying at the Moon

February 23, 2011 3:03 PM | Link to this

A lot of the Democratic party’s funding comes from unions. Union busting by Republicans is intended to weaken the Democratic party at local, state and national levels. Nothing more, nothing less, just a political maneuver. The entire budget component of union busting is a smoke screen, a distraction from the real intention. Kasich already got rich raiding state retirement funds as Lehman Brothers, now he wants to do away with them. I can’t understand why people are willing to believe a word he says.

By Teri

February 23, 2011 2:48 PM | Link to this

@squirrely: If you make $30,000 odds are you have far less education than a teacher. Shouldn’t that count for something? And I noticed you said you “opted” for lower HC coverage. If SB5 passes they won’t have any choice in what hc they get. And hc from the retirement systems is no prize. I can’t even afford it. My husbands small company offers better with lower costs. Still expensive but better than the retirement systems.

By Burt

February 23, 2011 2:47 PM | Link to this

Squirrellygirl states “Unions have proven to be bullish, secretive, and extremely politically driven”. I think she really meant to say “Kasich has proven to be bullish, secretive, and extremely politically driven”.

By Jenny

February 23, 2011 2:40 PM | Link to this

Has no one given full consideration to what the end affect of SB5 and the changes in the retirement system will cause? When public workers have no job security through senority, everytime the school board or city gets into financial trouble the first thing they will do it let the workers who have the highest salary go. Makes financial sense. After all, you can high a new worker for a fraction. And since no one is going to hire them at a higher salary we can be assured that they will have to stay at an entry level salary or leave the field. Now, most of the retirement systems are going to require workers to spend more years in service before they can retire. When workers are constantly let go they won’t be contributing to the retirement system which will then go broke for current retirees but heck, the newer employees won’t be needing the systems since no one will be working long enough to collect. Guess the problem is solved. Oh, wait, now we don’t have enough police, fire, ems or teachers. Hmmm.

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 2:33 PM | Link to this

“If bill 5 passes that will be even smaller year after year and who would want to teach then in the state of OHIO?” People who need a job. You can go somewhere else where you think you can get what you are worth. Personally, I’m tired of paying you $60,000 a year when I’ve worked and paid taxes all my life and make just a little more than HALF of that! And I just elected to have inferior hc coverage because I couldn’t afford the hc insurance I was use to. But you go ahead and tell me I need to pay you more and not make you pay more for your benefits and on top of that protect you from EVER losing your job, and let you retire at 55 or whatever the age is now. Go ahead and tell me again! I’ll be working till the day I die because I keep getting layed off and losing my previous benefits and have to withdraw my 401K to live on each time and then have to pay 30% in taxes for doing that! Tell me again how you should be protected from everything I have to go through as a worker in the private sector. Down with ALL UNIONS!

By judi P

February 23, 2011 2:31 PM | Link to this

Gee what a surprise: “WED FEB 23, 2011 AT 02:20 PM EST Fox flips poll results to falsely claim Americans support union-busting byJed Lewison ….”

By Judi P

February 23, 2011 2:28 PM | Link to this

FOX flips poll numbers o suggest WI gov. support: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/02/23/948814/-Fox-flips-poll-results-to-falsely-claim-Americans-support-union-busting?utmsource=feedburner&utmmedium=feed&utmcampaign=Feed%3A+dailykos%2Findex+%28Daily+Kos%29&utmcontent=Twitter

By Louise

February 23, 2011 2:21 PM | Link to this

@Urbandweller, what happens when all public service workers decide to take your advice and find another job? It seems like you and some others think only non-public service workers ever “earn” pay raises. And, please, don’t be so self-righteous as to believe that you could “never” be in a position to do the lowly work of a public service worker and belong to a union. Most of us are only an office visit away from being unemployed. At which point we take what we can get.

By Half-Brain

February 23, 2011 2:14 PM | Link to this

I’ve worked 33+ years without being in a union. Good pay and benefits, don’t need a union. By the way, I, with half a brain, can recall that Democrats controlled the House and Senate the last 2 years of GW’s term. The Dems controlled both House and Senate first 2 years of BHO’s reign. That’s 4 years of Democrat budgets, so put blame where it belongs. Unfortunately, if you took a poll, probably 85% of voters wouldn’t know this. Must be they are worse than me and have less than half a brain.

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 2:12 PM | Link to this

Paul, I know you dems have a small retention span, but you guys lost last election. That’s why Kasich is in there trying to fix what you guys broke. Unions have proven to be bullish, secretive, and extremely politically driven in the way they have been handling their workers’ pensions. Government workers will be layed off if there is no compromise. Asking them to contribute to their hc benefits and renegotiating pensions is not asking too much when you consider how much the private sector workers pay for the same. Unions don’t care if their members are layed off. Unions are busy backing the overthrow of the Egyptian and other foreign governments. Unions are dirty, and their president talks to our President Obama daily on the phone and is welcomed to the White House a few times a week (his words). Unions+Pres Obama = Communism. Straight up!

By Bsmith

February 23, 2011 2:08 PM | Link to this

How much do you think teachers and Public workers get paided? Not a whole lot PEOPLE. Next question how many people can afforted a 20% pay cut? How many people would lose their homes becuase of that pay cut. How many people who teach or work for the state be able to retire at a good age? NOT A Whole lot. Take a look at my situation I teach and make 60,000 before taxes take 20% from that. What is it $12,000 per year or $462.00 per pay check. Before the high taxes that we pay all ready in the State of OHIO are taken out. Which leave me with $1845.00 before taxes.I must remind you I am still in my tax bracket. I didn’t go down. I am tax about $725.00 per check. WHich leaves me with 1120.00 per pay check or $2240 per month. Which leaves me with to pay bills and to go back to school to keep my job $30,000 per year. Can you leave on that? If bill 5 passes that will be even smaller year after year and who would want to teach then in the state of OHIO?

By Navin Johnson

February 23, 2011 2:06 PM | Link to this

Sam, Please factually explain why you,during an economic downturn, as an government employee would pay more taxes than the average Joe on the street? Your wife lost her job after 14 yrs, and you have a child. Unfortunate yes, but none of that makes you unique. Its the things the private sector and public non-union employees deal with daily. We just deal with it. We don’t post comments on a blog, beleiving in some way we’ve been screwed by some faceless bureaucrat. You also say you are not one of people who have taken a free ride. Just who are these people? None of them seem to post. and Paul, Ohio had buyers remorse, that why Kasich is now the gov. That’s why so many Dems lost their jobs back in Nov. Ignoring facts won’t make them go away.

By paul

February 23, 2011 2:02 PM | Link to this

Ohiodale, thanks for regurgitating right wing talking points, too bad none of them are true. Heres a news flash, most corporations dont pay any taxes and union members pay incredibly high taxes state and federal. Further more Obama didnt create the defict, he just told the truth about it, what part about bush/cheney keeping the Iraq and Afghan wars off the books that are on them now didnt you understand? You liked it better when bush/cheney lied to you about what we really owed? And did you miss the part where the deficit would be exactly the same had McCain won? Most of the spending bills that came into effect were passed when bush was still in? Get some knowledge and some information other than from right wing talking heads before making a fool out of yourself again. The republicans made this mess and only a fool would believe they would or could get us out of it. Unions arent the problem and neither are the workers. If thats true why is it that during the bush admin over 46000 factories closed or went offshore? Wall Street crashed on bush’s watch, why take it out on workers now? They didnt make this mess but they are under attack because people like you buy into the right wing lies, spin and misinformation.

By ohiodale

February 23, 2011 1:50 PM | Link to this

Is it me or do others find it hyocritical for liberals to talk about the deficit when Obama increased the debt 4 trillion in only two years. This has everything to do with the state debts so to say it doesn’t is very ignorant. On the news this morning they asked one of the leaders of this protest his solution to fixing the huge state debts. His answer was to raise taxes on the rich and corporations. How many times do we need to hear this same stupid solution which has been proved throughout history to not work. The rich already pay most of the taxes and to tax them more will kill tax revenue (when they move to other states) and cause more companies to move to other states and other countries. The unions were once important but now they are extorting corporations. Just because the unions helped workers 100 years ago doesn’t mean they haven’t become corrupt and as bad as the corporations once were when unions started. I for one am not for paying more taxes to support union’s lavish pensions and early retirments!!!

By paul

February 23, 2011 1:37 PM | Link to this

The republicans drove the nation off a cliff, gave us record deficits and now they want to fix it on the backs of working men and women? Ohio had better pay closer attention to the corporate criminals they put in office like Kasick. This has nothing to do with deficits and everything to do with furthering the political agenda of the republican party. Kasick is like a temporary employee, shows up, steals office supplies then takes off…Kasick will go to some lobbyist job or some other cushy corporate job after he does their dirty work. Buyers remorse here in Ohio, kick out Kasick NOW!

By SAM JONES

February 23, 2011 1:33 PM | Link to this

@DRPECKERWOOD, never have I seen it were goverment employees do not pay taxes, where is that at in the contract? WE PAY TAXES TOO…in most cases, we pay more taxes than most others do, due to the fact that we too are effected by this downturn, you see I have taken on a second job because my wife’s company closed down last fall, and after 14 yrs she has nothing to show for it, I also have a young daughter to support. What most of you BOSSES( thanks doc.) don;t understand is mostly all unclassified employees(non-union) have taken concessions for the past two years while our union brothers have not. Don’t not lump us all together, not all of us have had FREE RIDES. will comment some more, but I gotta get back to work, because that is the reason I show up everyday………

By UrbanDweller

February 23, 2011 1:24 PM | Link to this

I’m not, nor ever would be, in a union yet somehow I have reasonable health benefits and my annual merit increases are based on my work performance. What is so bad about that? Public employees are there to serve the public and are paid by the public. They should not be unionized. If they don’t like it, then they can find a job where they aren’t a public employee.

By Dayton Union Workers

February 23, 2011 1:21 PM | Link to this

I would like to point out that City of Dayton union members have been making cuts and working with the city for the last 5 YEARS. No pay raises or cost of living raises, 5 furlough days, Health insurance has gone from $40 a month to over $300, and most departments have been cut over 25% in manpower, but still getting the job done. These are facts, look at the police, fire and DPSU contracts for the last 5 years. The cuts are in there, plain as day. For all of you who says the unions need to make changes, we have been, for years. Get the facts before you say its a gravy train. AFter the least round of contract negotiations, the NON UNION CITY OFFICIALS gave themselves raises, on the CUTS the unions gave back. This is why collective bargaining is needed, or the ones who hold the money only give it to themselves!

By Matt

February 23, 2011 1:11 PM | Link to this

And this is why we have a republic rather than a true democracy. If people could vote others less rights to save themselves tax monies, they would every time.

By ReallyRichard?

February 23, 2011 1:07 PM | Link to this

“You could have a police department that is forced to maintain loyalty to a political party or the mayor….in order to get the favor of merit increases…and members of the the other party could see themselves getting ticketed, arrested, etc.” I couldn’t even get all the way through your post, Richard, without commenting on this point. Are you attempting to say that unions are not currently politically driven? Really, Richard? Who visits President Obama a few times every week and talks to him daily on the phone? Huh? You would know the answer to this question if you watched a reputable news media. Unions have undeniable ties with the Democratic party. We have already seen government imps pilfering through government files to find dirt on political opponents or those who speak against their political machines. Joe the Plumber and Health & Human Services comes to mind. BTW, that lady who lost her job just got a better job with more money. So she got rewarded for abusing government records and using government e-mail against her political opponents.

By Burt

February 23, 2011 1:05 PM | Link to this

The Governor says that collective bargaining ties the hands of administrators. He fails to point out that unfunded mandates and 20% state funding cuts also tie administrators hands. I think the current fight over collective bargaining is just a smoke screen so people will forget about the 20% state cut in funding.

By drparkwood

February 23, 2011 12:57 PM | Link to this

Why is this so hard for the left and gov unions to get. We the TAX PAYER are your boss PERIOD. The left used our tax dollars to reward you for your voting them into office. Did you riote and threaten people when this occured. So why through hissy fits and protest now that we are trying to take control of OUR TAX DOLLARS back. You should just say THANK YOU to us, enjoy the FREE RIDE you’ve had for so many years and get over yourself.

By Jelane

February 23, 2011 12:35 PM | Link to this

Corporations don’t move offshore because they had to survive. They do it to maximize profits. And they do it whether unions are involved or not. Look at all the IT offshoring that is going on. IT has never been a unionized industry. Companies just figured out they could pay pennies on the dollar offshore. All the while, corporate profits and executive pay soar while the average wage has stagnated over the past 30 years.

By Richard

February 23, 2011 12:25 PM | Link to this

Public Safety Unions and Collective Bargaining are just one of the many measures that put an end to political patronage and corruption in police and fire departments. Could this bill risk bringing all that back? Possibly. You could have a police department that is forced to maintain loyalty to a political party or the mayor….in order to get the favor of merit increases…and members of the the other party could see themselves getting ticketed, arrested, etc. Or certain influential local businessmen could exert their political muscle to get the police to drive out their competitors…or the fire department to respond slower to certain fires. Take away the unions and you create a system where people can be bought. Instead of being impartial professionals, your police and fire will be way too preoccupied working on their next “merit” raise. And if your problem/emergency doesn’t fit the criteria established for the merit raise system….it falls to the bottom of the priority list and/or…they just won’t do anything for you. Good luck with this. I hope that all of you who are angry with the unions have enough money to buy your own police protection. That’s how it used to be….before collective bargaining.

By Collective Nonsense

February 23, 2011 11:55 AM | Link to this

Back in the 1920s unions were needed. Now unions are dragging everything down. Wonder why companies move to mexico, canada and elswhere? Now you know.

By ToFrank

February 23, 2011 11:39 AM | Link to this

The Huffington Post—that communist rag? “CNN and Huffington Post urge violence against Republicans? Yeah Marxists, we have seen this before… Report by Big Government.com. It’s time you break kneecaps… It’s time to destroy the Republican Party. They don’t deserve a seat at the table when all they want to do is score political points by being the Party of No.” I’m sorry, but what were you saying? Once I heard Huffington Post, I knew it was going to lean to the communist position.

By Smoking on the grounds...

February 23, 2011 11:32 AM | Link to this

I have worked both state and Federal unions. The most recent was the VA. The crap I experienced was so unbelievable in both arenas. People are angry at these public state and Federal workers who have some kind of magnetic field protectionism for their wages and benefits. If the private sector has to slim down, why doesn’t the bloated, incompetent and self-perpetuating public union follow suit? You sure can’t fire em!!! Madison teachers are whining like the Greeks 9 months ago!!

By frank

February 23, 2011 11:31 AM | Link to this

Squirrleyone: you are such a hoot. Oh, how about this: the Walker-Koch connection…phone, that is http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/23/scott-walker-buffalo-beast-phone-prankn827058.html

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 11:30 AM | Link to this

Although it’s a tad off topic, it’s all connected. You know who really pays for these families receiving these huge tax refunds for all those kids they have when they didn’t even pay that much in taxes? It’s the poor single people. We get no tax breaks, but we are paying for you to have all those kids. Is that fair? No, in no world is it fair. Our government has no right to redistribute our “wealth” from single tax payers to people who have large families and made that decision to do so. And the redistribution of Americans’ taxes to job in China SHOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED, but it did—UNDER OBAMA’S WATCH! BTW, also off topic, but guess who watch it was under that terrorists are sneaking through our southern border! It’s in the news—if you can find a media station that still carries the news, that is.

By ToVoiceOfReason

February 23, 2011 11:24 AM | Link to this

The liberal polls will always favor liberal beliefs. However, a sure fire way to know what THE PEOPLE want is HOW DID THEY VOTE last election? Huh? The people want the unions stripped of their power because it has been ABUSED. The people want the government to renegotiate benefits and pensions, and the people want the government to have that ability, just like in the private sector. Unions must not be able to bully people into voting a certain way, thus, voting should be done IN SECRET. And making it mandatory to belong to a union in order to get a government contract is COMMUNIST, and unions are indeed COMMUNIST and are our Republic’s ENEMIES! The unions are an ememy to our economy, they are driving prices up and businesses out of our country or out of business. Unions have turned into a different animal that now sides with the same Islam Brotherhood that wants to immediately go to war with Israel as soon as they take over Egypt. Their own words, folks. And your pension dues were stolen by your unions to fund this crap over there. Just remember that.

By Perspective

February 23, 2011 11:17 AM | Link to this

SB5 has to do with public service workers unions,nothing at all about private sector unions. @Voice of Reason-There is no one getting rich off of SB5. Off topic but wealth is already re-distributed through the IRS. Did you know that a lot of low income people/families receive thousands of dollars more from their returns than they actually paid in taxes? If that’s not redistribution of wealth(taxpayer money) I don’t know what is.

By Voice of Reason

February 23, 2011 11:09 AM | Link to this

Poll: Americans favor union bargaining rights By Dennis Cauchon, USA TODAY MADISON, Wis. — Americans strongly oppose laws taking away the collective bargaining power of public employee unions, according to a new USA TODAY/Gallup Poll. The poll found 61% would oppose a law in their state similar to such a proposal in Wisconsin, compared with 33% who would favor such a law.

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:59 AM | Link to this

Your scare tactics won’t work. “If the politicians get rid of unions, next they will get rid of Social Security, medicare, your retirement and health care, and the top 5% will become richer and richer.” It’s not true. Unions have nothing to do with social security, etc. Health care fiasco bill was not debated before it was rushed through. That’s why there are hundreds of requests for waivers. The democrats never defended their positions on taxpayers paying for abortions, nor death panels in case of shortfalls, nor the mandatory requirement to purchase insurance. This bill needs to be gutted.

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:52 AM | Link to this

I’m a poor girl. I’ll probably always be a poor girl. I’m happy to have a job right now. However, I still don’t believe in stealing money, even from rich people. Those rich people are the ones who create jobs for people like me whose parents were also poor. Redistribution of wealth by taxing rich people more than anywhere else in the world is not going to help our economy. Most of the redistributed money is not “well” spent, and is instead shipped off to China for jobs there, or other foreign countries, or to community organizations, special interest groups, even illegal immigrants benefits, and to communist organizations that are trying to overthrow our republic. That money never belonged to our government. Our government was never meant to be so big that we the people now fear it. This is tyranny, folks.

By taxpayer

February 23, 2011 10:49 AM | Link to this

The Gov. is right I agree you have to stop spending…..with-out this amendment the UNIONS will want more & more the TAX DOLLAR BUCKET is EMPTY……….

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:43 AM | Link to this

Unions are passee. They no longer are needed. Back in the day, they were needed. Now, they are a hindrance. Government workers will get layed off if the government can’t renegotiate benefits/pensions. The workers don’t want to get layed off, they need their jobs, too. Unions are not looking out for those government workers who WILL get layed off if workers aren’t contributing their fair share to benefits and pensions LIKE PRIVATE SECTOR HAS TO. You can’t justify public workers making more and having better benefits than those for whom they are SUPPOSED to be serving, the tax payers! The government can’t survive without tax payers. People can’t pay their taxes if they don’t have jobs. Government is broke. We are dependent on foreign governments for our survival. This can’t go on like this forever. Our economy is headed on the WRONG path, and the voters spoke very clearly last election.

By Voice of Reason

February 23, 2011 10:39 AM | Link to this

This is a win-win for the rich. First they get the politicians to vote them a tax cut which creates a budget problem. Then politicians blame the unions for the budget problem and try to destroy the unions so the rich can pay workers less money and have bigger profits. If the politicians get rid of unions, next they will get rid of Social Security, medicare, your retirement and health care, and the top 5% will become richer and richer.

By Navin Johnson

February 23, 2011 10:37 AM | Link to this

Judi, Rasmussen is independent, and Scott Rasmussen’s polls are well respected on both sides. Also Quinnipiac is cited in the poll. They are definately do not lean to the right. DDN watches FOX??? Are you really insinuating DDN leans to the right?

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:37 AM | Link to this

Judi, judi, judi…Our representatives were elected to do their jobs. Dems lost because the PEOPLE voted them out. So then the Dems cheat the PEOPLE and leave the state. In what world is that okay? They should be FIRED. Unions have driven up the cost of doing business to the point where Americans are losing their jobs to foreign countries. Unions are no longer representing their members. People are going to lose their jobs if the government can’t renegotiate their benefits/salaries/pensions. Judi, listen to the voters, not your cohorts who are trying to overthrow our Republic.

By judi

February 23, 2011 10:37 AM | Link to this

A USA Today/Gallup survey released Wednesday indicates that 61 percent of the public would oppose a move in their state to pass a bill that would take away some of the collective bargaining rights of union government workers, with one in three saying they’d support such a move.

By Bill M

February 23, 2011 10:32 AM | Link to this

Would more people be convinced if they knew this was all being engineered by the Koch brothers - ultra right-wing billionaires - so they can get sweet no bid deals. They contributed heavily in Wisconsin and also to Kasich. These greedy SOB’s seem to be addicted to money and power and could care less about the middle class. Just google Koch Brothers

By toMW

February 23, 2011 10:31 AM | Link to this

We’re all tax payers. That does not excuse public employees from sharing in the “bad times” and having to renegotiate salaries and benefits. I hope you aren’t one of those people who believe that you can spend your way out of a recession. BTW, does anybody really believe the recession is over? I never thought it was. Food, oil, gas—everything is going up. Unemployment, too. It’s not a good environment, and the last two years have been hard on people looking for jobs and has created a very unfriendly business environment. Obama should lift the moratorium on oil drilling here in U.S. waters for Americans and he should release the U.S. reserves to drive down the gas prices. He should forget attacking the coal industry. We need to unskyrocket his created catastrophe of energy prices. It would help if Obama kept his nose out of protecting unions which are communist and are helping to create some of the rebellions, like in Egypt. Unions should be investigated for how they have been spending their members pension funds on these political rebellions.

By judi

February 23, 2011 10:30 AM | Link to this

Then there’s this poll: http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/poll-majority-opposes-laws-restricting-public-employee-unions/ Just saying…….

By judi

February 23, 2011 10:29 AM | Link to this

Then there’s this poll: http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/poll-majority-opposes-laws-restricting-public-employee-unions/ Just saying…….

By judi

February 23, 2011 10:27 AM | Link to this

Or maybe this from FORBES: http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/robert-schlesinger/2011/02/22/poll-voters-oppose-wisconsin-gov-scott-walker-in-union-standoff Too much FOX watching at DDN.

By judi

February 23, 2011 10:25 AM | Link to this

You’re kidding, right? Rasmussen is a right wing pollster…..of course it would show voters on the Republican govs side. Try this one for a TRUE look: http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/robert-schlesinger/2011/02/22/poll-voters-oppose-wisconsin-gov-scott-walker-in-union-standoff Talk about bias on DDN.

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:23 AM | Link to this

IMO if representatives take off this whole week and then only have a few days to negotiate agreement on not shutting down government offices, perhaps they should forego their paychecks. Why should they be paid for not doing their jobs? When the Wisconsin senators disappear and don’t show up for votes, they have adversely impacted the government’s ability to do its job. They should be replaced. Period. Dot. Lose their jobs. Government must be able to increase the contributions they pay for benefits and pensions. If not, government workers will lose their jobs. Government is broke. What part of “broke” don’t you understand? For the good of the government workers, the government must be able to negotiate this. Not to mention that the rest of us have been paying MUCH MUCH MORE contributions towards our health care benefits, and pensions (what a joke). It’s hard to build up retirement money when you keep having to search for a new job after freshly being layed off, over and over again. Public workers should share in bad times as well as in good. These are bad times, so we all need to catch up.

By MW

February 23, 2011 10:20 AM | Link to this

@Squirrellygirl, public employees are taxpayers, too. We pay into the same coffers that in turn pay us. So essentially we are paying our own salaries and benefits by paying our taxes.

By theshawn

February 23, 2011 10:19 AM | Link to this

All I know is that unions in all cases, raise the costs for everything. They have an entitlement mentality that someone owes them their job. They believe that working for 20-30 years is worth 60 years of pay. Their pension plans are economically unfeasable, but they don’t care, they believe they’re owed cushy retirement plans. Of course those of us who actually pay for their retirements are supposed to be thankful for them and their “sacrifice” as they continually ask for more of our money to pay for it. The union pious self aggrandizement makes me want to gag.

By Nobody

February 23, 2011 10:15 AM | Link to this

“We may keep unions in the private sector to protect us from the nasty bosses: but why do we need unions in the public sector - after all, doesn’t government have our best interest at heart.” -Kinnynobo By that logic we don’t need the Bill of Rights!

By Squirrellygirl

February 23, 2011 10:14 AM | Link to this

There is a small percentage of our workers who belong to unions. I don’t believe in mandatorily having to belong to a union, you must have a choice, and that choice must be made in secret so as to maintain that person’s true choice. In cases of public unions, I think it is completely right to allow them to bargain on salary, but the government must be able to negotiate and make decisions regarding benefits. In the case of Wisconsin, they should be contributing more for their health care benefits and for their pensions. Public workers should not be making more money, nor should they have better benefits than the people they are serving, us taxpayers. Unions are more and more communist now. You can see their logos in the Greece riots and everywhere around the world, “Workers of the World Unite”—imo unions should not be able to send money to political causes because its members don’t all go with one political party. Gov’t should not be bailing out unions or their pension funds. Teachers unions are no better, and are even worse that the private sector unions. Education in America has not improved since the government made it go Federal, and the Dept of Education should be either abolished or at the very least cut back in funding. Absolutely no bail outs for pensions.

By Dayton boy

February 23, 2011 10:06 AM | Link to this

Nobody is talking about the other side of this issue; the state bargaining officials. They are as much to blame as the unions. If the unions must sacrifice for the greater good, then the state officials also should give up their salary and benefits that are above the private sector averages.

By kinnynobo

February 23, 2011 9:37 AM | Link to this

The concept of ‘unions’ was devised to protect workers from unjust employer practices. These bad practices occured in the private sector - mining, factories, etc. It worked fine in curtailing such practices:but people saw other opportunities for unions. Unions have changed much from the past and now their directive points to causing problems to their benefactors. We may keep unions in the private sector to protect us from the nasty bosses: but why do we need unions in the public sector - after all, doesn’t government have our best interest at heart.