By answers yahoo

June 28, 2011 12:05 PM | Link to this

Nice subject great exececution on your site

By tshiverd

March 13, 2011 11:48 AM | Link to this

The fact is “Real History”, that if you read the text of Hitler’s speach in May 1932 outlawing unions, and then Read Kasich’s remark’s on all this and they are very similar. That is the comparison. No one is insinuating he would or could kill millions. But he does think he can do whatever he wants and rules and ethics be damned. The bottom line is for this bill to save money, public employees salaries must be drastically cut. I don’t know about you, but I don’t want minimum wage teachers, fire fighters, and police officers. I don’t want people doing those jobs that are just doing them until they can find a real job that will allow them to support their families. You people won’t be happy until we are all on welfare. I work two jobs, my wife works full time, and we still struggle to tithe, save, and not be in debt. We should all be fighting for a living wage, not more profits for the super rich. Look at Texas and other states with “right to work” their debts are just as bad or worse. This is just union busting, not money savings, and it’s busting (for the most part) small professional unions with little or no corruption. You all talk like your fighting the ghost of Jimmy Hoffa! Kasich needs to go back to Lehman Brothers and leave us alone!

By bill

March 9, 2011 8:55 AM | Link to this

Argue all you want about this proposed bill,but the fact that kasich has had to replace members of the commity 3 times to get the vote he wants on this tells anyone with a brain that something is wrong with the bill.Even kasichs friend and tea party leader says what kasichs’ doing is wrong and defeats the purpose of politics.so much for govt transparency…and if were in such a financial crisis why are his cabninent members getting significant raises when everyone else is taking concessions???? lets look at their lavish pensions and healthcare costs to the state…….

By Richard

March 3, 2011 7:10 AM | Link to this

@teacher You got a friggin thank you teach. You work part time and are over paid and under worked. Stop your whining and go find a pacifier. You are an unstable neurotic

By Teacher

March 2, 2011 9:55 PM | Link to this

“Absolutely no one with a brain would get a masters in Ed over an MBA. Do not blame us, the taxpayers, for your your husband’s poor judgement.My guess is he could not get admitted to an MBA program……….dah!!!!!” Oh please! If it weren’t for teachers giving you an education to begin with, you would never have the opportunity to get your MBA. Maybe some of you should see what teachers have to go through to become a teacher and all of the standards we have to meet and then come back and tell me that we are being paid too much and hurting the tax payer. If you are going to treat teachers this poorly, keep your kids at home and educate them yourselves! Most teachers don’t even get a thank you for everything they do for the kids.

By Retired Teacher

March 2, 2011 8:31 PM | Link to this

Looking back on my teaching yrs. in the Ohio public schools, I was hired in at $8,000 my first year and was proud to make it to $55,000 when I retired. I had no problem with paying for my BS and Masters myself. I worked nights and weekends and gave up time with my family as I thought it would benefit my students and never felt it wasn’t worth it. And I spent so much on my students and classroom that I have actually saved money by retiring. Our teachers paid 10% in to pensions (which will be increased to 12% soon) and the increasing cost of health insurance, as that was part of the job. I voted Republican, as I like their conservative views and resented having to pay dues that were going to support the election of Democrats. But now I find that I cost people too much money. I went in to teaching to educate your children, not to make money. My question to you would be where are the people who want to be educators if it’s all about money? At least I put in good intentions and time, versus those on the dole collecting government money.

By Real History

March 2, 2011 10:54 AM | Link to this

Like a typical liberal—Historian has rewritten history and excluded facts. Mao killed between 49-78 million people. Stalin purged 23 million people. This just shows how desperate the liberals are becoming—comparing Kasich to Stalin and Walker to Hitler. Please, debate SB5 based on the facts, not made up lies.

By Historian

March 2, 2011 10:34 AM | Link to this

A brief history lesson for all of you bashing unions as communist or socialist: Communist countries such as China and the former Soviet Union do not allow unions or strikes. Any union that does exist is just a puppet of the government. It was actually a union, Solidarity, that brought down communism in Poland. Your savior, Gov. Kasich, has more in common with Stalin and Mao on this issue than the unions.

By Mike R

March 2, 2011 10:01 AM | Link to this

Schooled, I didn’t insinuate anything about teachers not having real jobs. Nor I have referred to anyone as a “slug.” Go back and read my posts. I simply asked how your husband could be surprised the minimum salary is $20K. That has been the case since the 1990’s! By the way, I know quite well about “university.” I have a Masters of Science.

By dave

March 2, 2011 9:26 AM | Link to this

We have to control spending, and I understand the need to control wages and benefits of public workers. But are we going to balance the budget on the backs of working people? What about all the money spent giving benefits to people that don’t even try to get a job. We need to take care of those unable to take care of themselves, but we are spending millions on welfare for people that can work and are doing nothing. We pay for their housing, their food, their heat in the winter and much more. We need to do some cutting on these programs too. The other side of cutting wages is there will be less tax revenue and less money to spend on consumer items.

By Perspective

March 2, 2011 8:42 AM | Link to this

@schooled So what makes you think your husband is going to take a $20k hit on salary? You obviously haven’t read the bill.

By Squirrellygirl

March 2, 2011 8:31 AM | Link to this

You want to know who is fighting for the middle class? Kasich is trying to save your jobs, folks. People will be layed off if they can’t renegotiate the outlandish benefits of public workers. I agree that (if Kasich did) Kasich should not have given his cabinet 30% raise, if this happened it should be reversed. It isn’t right to give raises when you are expecting public workers to renegotiate their salaries. But public workers should not able to go on strike. They should go find other jobs if they don’t like their jobs. Unions are communist, and we need to erase them completely from the public sector. Until then, being able to negotiate salaries is still happening with this bill. I can’t believe public workers don’t see that their contributions to their benefits need to be in line with what the private sector is paying. Unfortunately, our own President and Attorney General are in bed with the Unions, so we can’t expect any help from “within” our government.

By Jon p

March 2, 2011 8:20 AM | Link to this

@ schooled Absolutely no one with a brain would get a masters in Ed over an MBA. Do not blame us, the taxpayers, for your your husband’s poor judgement.My guess is he could not get admitted to an MBA program……….dah!!!!!

By Erica H

March 2, 2011 8:19 AM | Link to this

@ schooled Absolutely no one with a brain would get a masters in Ed over an MBA. Do not blame us, the taxpayers, for your your husband’s poor judgement.My guess is he could not get admitted to an MBA program……….dah!!!!!

By Tiffany

March 2, 2011 8:17 AM | Link to this

@ schooled Absolutely no one with a brain would get a masters in Ed over an MBA. Do not blame us, the taxpayers, for your your husband’s poor judgement.

By Bill

March 2, 2011 6:10 AM | Link to this

All those against collective bargaining for government workers have to do is get a copy of sheriff plummer’s contract with the fop. Once you read it you will puke in disbelief. 6 days Personal leave a year, up to five weeks vacation a year that can roll over for 3.9 years or a balance of 20 weeks, 15 sick leave days a year with no accumulation limit, then it’s paid out at retirement 50 % at current rate, and it goes on and on.

By Schooled

March 2, 2011 1:09 AM | Link to this

@ Mike R. How dare you insinuate that teaching is not a “real” job? Do you have children…and if so do you care about their educational needs? I’m just stating that teachers are taking the brunt of the salary cut but the administrative positions will most likely be untouched. My husband was shocked because he just finished his masters that was required for his position. I’m assuming that you know NOTHING about university so let me educate you…it’s expensive, and NO we did not free ride off of the government to pay for it. How frustrating…to pay all of that money to lose 20,000 next year. Had we known this he would have gone back for his M.B.A instead of his masters in educational leadership. I understand that the budget needs to be cut, but cut EVERYONE not just the run of the mill teachers, principals, school board etc. Also don’t assume that all teachers are slugs in the summers. My husband sells insurance on the side (goes into the office early and stays late, weekdays and weekends)and truly knows the meaning of hard work. Please, don’t sit on your ” holier than thou private sector throne” and assume that you are better than everyone. In fact, judging by all of your posts I hardly believe that you work anywhere but on Dayton Daily News.Com. Jerk

By karon

March 2, 2011 12:51 AM | Link to this

Some teachers and some union people did vote for Kasich! Those who voted for Kasich did NOT do their homework about this man. I watched Strickland and Kasich when they had those 2 debates! As soon as Kasich said NO passenger trains for Ohio , I knew that Kasich wasnt interested in creating jobs! Trains for Ohio would have meant thousands of new jobs with the building up of Ohio infrastructure! Infrastructure jobs are powerful and also Ohioians would have enjoyed a alternative type of transportation that passenger trains would have offered!

By Donald

March 1, 2011 11:34 PM | Link to this

If you are speaking of Dayton fire union,then screw them. These are the clowns who refused to live in the city . They fought the residency and won.my motto is , if you hate living here so much, then go work in your new town..these people are a joke…

By A truthful interview

March 1, 2011 11:27 PM | Link to this

Interview from a fire scene: as given to mark the slug by a reporter; Reporter: “can you tell us what happened here tonite,firefighter slug”? Fire slug mark:” well,since we had to actually pay for some of our benefits now, our response time has been extended because we are selfish losers who couldnt care less about the public we serve. It’s all about our freeloading and perks..” Reporter:”how can such tragedies ,such as this fatal fire here tonite be avoided?” Fire slug mark:” well to be honest, pay us more money and give us more free benefits to mouch on and lastly dont smoke in bed” I believe these unions are the biggest threat to this city. With them, you see their priorities shine thru….

By Chuck in Dayton

March 1, 2011 11:24 PM | Link to this

Hey Teachers…If you don’t like the change that is coming get yourself a real job. Your days of special treatment are over. Fire half the administrators and you will still have too many for what they do. Socialism is killing this country. Vote Tea Party!!!

By Mark

March 1, 2011 10:00 PM | Link to this

@Carrie…you must make over 200.000k a year. Congrats, when the paramedic, firefighter, police officer, is making 10$ an hour we will see how long it takes for you to get help because we will all be working in the private sector. Thanks Carrie

By Mike R

March 1, 2011 9:55 PM | Link to this

Edison, were you not aware of the duties, tasks, requirements, and demands of teachers while you were racking up $50K in student loans? Many people, in the private sector, spend time well before or after “normal” business hours preparing for meetings, training, employee reviews, etc.

By Logan

March 1, 2011 9:52 PM | Link to this

Has anyone read that Kasich and our legislators are going to put themselves under the same healthcare umbrella they are going to require for public workers? I didn’t think so.

By Laura

March 1, 2011 9:49 PM | Link to this

@Ohiodale: “they aren’t saying they’re cutting wages”? Yet. But in reality they are. If workers must pay higher and higher amounts into their pension plans and more and more of their health care premiums without raising salaries, they are taking paycuts. More taken out of paychecks= less income=paycut.

By An educator

March 1, 2011 9:38 PM | Link to this

I am an educator. I have a reputation for treating my students fairly. I expect the same from administrators from whom I work. The proposals of this Kasich are allowing the opposite to happen. Administrators value expediency and flexibility for themselves at the expense of fair play.Therefore, these same adminis-trators are capable of and often guilty of arbitrary treatment. I am not necessarily a union person but if that is the only way to force administrators to communicate, then go for it. I do not favor keeping on undesirable and poorly performing teachers even if they have tenure. However, I do favor due process. If an administrator through multiple forms of evaluation including but not limited to announced and unannounced observation, student evaluations, informal observations of student teacher interaction etc. CAN DOCUMENT that a teacher is not doing the job in critical areas such as discipline, preparation for class, proper evaluation of student work, etc, that administrator should then take steps to remove that teacher but only after a pre-assigned period of remediation. There is room for fair play but not for arbitrary treatment. Kasich is overlooking that. Perhaps, he is a one term governor. What is your viewpoint?

By Edison

March 1, 2011 9:31 PM | Link to this

I spent $50 this week alone on my students’ needs. Teachers can only write off $250 per year. I spent from 7:45-5:30 in my classroom today ensuring my students were getting the education they deserve and then another 1.5 hours running errands to purchase school supplies. If we get pay cuts, I will not be able to provide for these children and pay for my degrees required to maintain my license. Don’t ask where their parents are, we are in economic decline. We all need to be realistic. I spent $50,000 at PUBLIC universities to obtain my degrees and I spend over half my paycheck to pay these loans back. I understand a need to prevent strikes and cut costs, but I also understand the need to keep health care costs and retirement reasonable for the little people who work themselves sick!

By Concerned citizen

March 1, 2011 9:26 PM | Link to this

Why not cut the number of state representaives and senators so the budget crisis can be solved for a long time to come. Do we really need so many to put burden on the state.

By Paul

March 1, 2011 9:23 PM | Link to this

LocalTeacher: Majority of Private sector workers pay for their own master’s degree. Regarding public employee unions, there’s no place for them in this day and age. Union contracts, especially if they’re 3 years or more, are too rigid for today’s world. We live in a global economy and technology forces everyone to make quick decisions and changes. No one, whether its private sector or government, has time to “negotiate” with the unions. The work environment is moving and changing very quickly and if you’re not flexible, you lose.

By jurassic park

March 1, 2011 9:21 PM | Link to this

After reading many comments SB 5 and hearing many write some scathing reviews I have come to some uneasy conclusions. Firstly, I had a student tell me the other day where were the teachers, firefighters, police officers, and other public workers unions when the private unions were broken? It is really hard for us to complain when we know we did not stand then. Our governor made money off of the death of private sector jobs on wall street—as did many opportunists. Now he is coming for Ohio public employees and one way or another he will get us. As an educator I cannot boast enough money to live. I currently am looking for a second job and I know many other masters educated people who are also looking for and working another job. Secondly, and very sadly there are educators out there who do make a whole lot of money. However, they too must pay taxes even state taxes on what they make. The more you cut for public employees the less you can charge them in taxes. This means that the state could fix the budget one year and completely blow it in less income tax being collected and probably cause a lot of young people to leave the state. Less people mean a lot of less tax dollars.

By True Story

March 1, 2011 9:07 PM | Link to this

Ohio state senator Shannon Jones did not write Senate bill 5, not one word. It comes from K-sick’s right wing “war on the middle class” think tank. Of all Ohio, Warren county gave K-sick his biggest voter margin of 51k votes over Governor Strickland. It’s political strategy to consider Jones’s Senate seat safe. So she’s the political stooge to introduce and champion the bill 5.

By voice of reason

March 1, 2011 8:43 PM | Link to this

Doesn’t add up is correct. There are states that have collective bargaining that are not in crisis [ Montana ] and there are states that do not have collective bargaining that are having a budget crises [Texas]. Collective bargaining is just a process, not a cause or cure for budgets. Remember the “Freedom isn’t free” slogan. Well, education, public safety and public services aren’t free either.

By Mike R

March 1, 2011 8:37 PM | Link to this

@Maxwell Powers: The difference is that when unions over-reach (see GM) the company goes broke and the worker loses much of what he has “won” in concessions. So, in most cases the private sector employees are cognizant not to stress the firm financially. In the public sector it is currently impossible for states to go bankrupt. It’s very difficult for municipalities to file bankruptcy. The unions know this and have “negotiated” far more than what the city or state can afford. Hence, big time budget and pension short falls.

By HaveSeen It

March 1, 2011 8:07 PM | Link to this

I really like it when the teachers blame the parents and home environment for poor student performance and then take the credit when high performance occurs? Which is it??? And then there’s the issue of regular classroom teachers and substitute teachers. When the teachers would strike and subs were brought in the teachers would badmouth the subs and take the position that ya really gotta have that regular classroom teacher for effective classroom teaching. But then the regulars take all their time off for sick leave, workshops, etc. and the subs are just fine and dandy as replacements when the regulars need to justify their being away from the classroom!! So, which is it??

By justwondering

March 1, 2011 8:05 PM | Link to this

It might help if the governor and the representatives took deep pay and benefits cuts themselves. $58K base salary (not including benefits ) for representatives seems a bit steep considering the budget crisis that we currently face because of decisions that they made. Perhaps the governor might admit to the reality that years of tax cuts that have disproportionately benefited corporations and the wealthy; have not had the positive impact on job creation that was expected. ( given that Ohio’s current unemployment rate is near 10%, ) And how about those tax cuts that we have enjoyed,…are we better off because of it? We have more than a few years of them to make a decision,…or have those savings in tax cuts been eaten away by rising food, energy costs,..ect,…) Might help if the governor admits that he will do for Ohio what he did for Lehman Brothers.

By max

March 1, 2011 8:02 PM | Link to this

As a “public employee”, I pay my own pension - 10% of my salary, soon to go up to almost 13% - SS witholding was only 6%. I put in more. AND, since I pay into a pension system instead of SS, I don’t get all of my SS or my spouse’s SS. That 60% I don’t get is going to pay someone else’s SS. And I may not have paid into a 401K that tanked, but my 403B did tank, so that’s no different than many others. If you can pass the physical for police or fire - go for it. I think I heard the police passing score was 66%? Don’t make my pay based on merit. How would a teacher earn merit pay for a student who’s parent says they don’t have to listen to the adults or they don’t have to come to school?? How does a teacher earn merit pay when a student qualifies for spec ed services, but yet they can’t be alternatively assessed? And Collective Bargaining - Allows communication between those in the trenches & those in the offices. It keeps resources in the classroom, necessary professional development available - and it keeps your kdg child in a class with less than 40 kids and allows the teacher to give your child some individual attention. Contracts are signed by 2 sides - and this public employee is bringing home less today than I was 5 years ago.

By Big C

March 1, 2011 7:55 PM | Link to this

Acoording to the Columbus Dispatch: Teachers’ salaries could still be bargained outside the proposed law’s pay ranges, but any pay raises for teachers would have to be based on merit. Under the bill, teacher performance is measured by considering the level of license held by the teacher, whether the teacher is a “highly qualified teacher” as defined in law, which includes factors such as student performance and other criteria.

By Me

March 1, 2011 7:42 PM | Link to this

Schooling starts at home. If you can’t control or educate your child at home in 16 hours,how do you expect us teachers to do it in 8 hours. Give us something to start with. There is more to parenting than just downloading child after child for free welfare etc.

By Maxwell Powers

March 1, 2011 7:36 PM | Link to this

I keep reading private sector workers trying to justify this power-grab by stating that they don’t get a say in benefits, so why should state workers? Well, turn it around for a second and ask yourself WHY DON’T YOU GET A SAY? The answer is because you’ve allowed management to cow you into believing this is the way it has to be. It doesn’t. When I see that private secotr workers by 23% of healthcare and public pays 10-15%, I don’t think the public sector is better off, I think the private sectore is being taken advantage of.

By doesn't add up

March 1, 2011 7:12 PM | Link to this

States without collective bargaining (Texas, Georgia, etc.) have on average WORSE State budget deficits than those that do have collective bargaining like Ohio and Wisconsin.

By right

March 1, 2011 7:12 PM | Link to this

Lay off 20% of them or cut their pay and benefits 20%. Its comming soon one way or another

By WW

March 1, 2011 6:54 PM | Link to this

Does anyone know who bought and paid for Shannon Jones? And who are the idiots in Springboro who gave us this loser?

By English recollection

March 1, 2011 6:48 PM | Link to this

@ null, Your post is a textbook example of first person point of view.

By null

March 1, 2011 6:40 PM | Link to this

I am a teacher and I am all for this as long as I am paid what I am worth. I am a special education teacher, so please don’t base it on merit. As a matter of fact since this is a field with teacher shortages, do I get paid more? Also, I am working on a doctorate, do I get a 6-figure salary? I also put in about 15 hours of overtime a week, do I get time and a half? Do I get paid for my time put in for required professional development and planning for the summer? I have never received less than excellent on any evaluation, do I get a raise? I am paid less than the average $50,000 a year that is commonly posted. I know many teachers who spend their own money, put in a lot of “overtime”, and have advanced degrees just like me. I think Ohio is getting one heck of a deal.

By Mike R

March 1, 2011 6:37 PM | Link to this

@Schooled. Why the shock? Currently the law, as agreed to by the union, has the minimum starting salary of teachers at $20,000. So, why is your husband shocked to see a $21K minimum salary? By the way, the free market has come up with a better salary. According to the latest data by the Ohio Dept. of Education the avg. starting salary for teachers is just under $34K—Nearly 70% higher than what the union negotiated!!

By Your Child's Teacher

March 1, 2011 6:31 PM | Link to this

Many Dayton area teacher unions have already taken 0% salary raises and increased health care contributions out of respect for how the poor economic climate is impacting their local communities. This has been happening for the past year or two without anyone in state government asking them to. Stop blaming our public employees for Ohio’s budget woes… Doing so is only a diversionary tactic away from the real causes and creates in-fighting instead of problem-solving.

By \Wife

March 1, 2011 6:20 PM | Link to this

No cut wages? Guess what? They already have, and city employees agreed to it. That’s what collective bargaining does. Our insurance doubled, we have not had a raise for 7 years, (after 15 years, you do not receive step raises), and we took an hour and two thirds pay cut per pay. In other words, that time is given back to the city by donating that time. And your ideas to find another job? Many people working for the city and schools have been there for years. If you’re not under 40, forget finding another job.

By Civics Lesson

March 1, 2011 6:14 PM | Link to this

According to a NY Times poll, the majority of Americans back employees in public sector unions. In our system of representation, our elected officials have an ethical duty to represent their constituents, regardless of party. Is that happening here? Or are they simply voting along party lines?

By Well-read

March 1, 2011 6:08 PM | Link to this

According to a NY Times poll, the majority of Americans back employees in public sector unions. In our system of representation, our elected officials have an ethical duty to represent their constituents, regardless of party. Is that happening here? Or are they simply voting along party lines?

By dhampton100

March 1, 2011 6:08 PM | Link to this

You all voted these neaderthals into office or you allowed them to get into office by not voting. You get what your hand calls for. Kasich and his crowd detest ALL poor people and the middle class.I never voted for him nor any other republican because I saw through their lies and I knew their plans.

By A Taxpayer

March 1, 2011 6:05 PM | Link to this

Public Employees are taxpayers, too! Let’s not forget that…

By Local Teacher

March 1, 2011 5:56 PM | Link to this

I am a local teacher and a member of the Ohio Education Association. For the record, our union dues DO NOT go toward political contributions or funding candidates. Collective bargaining protects YOUR CHILDREN by ensuring fair, safe, supportive classroom environments with lower class sizes, better resources, etc. Do you trust big government to have your child’s best interests at heart? There are so many misconceptions out there about who teachers are and what we do. We are expected to be “highly qualified” and hold advanced degrees, but unlike the private sector, must pay for our masters degrees and professional development ourselves. We do contribute significantly to our own retirement, but do not pay into nor will receive social security. If you have a question about our jobs, pay or benefits, please ask a teacher! Don’t listen to the rhetoric that is, at best, inaccurate.

By Right ON

March 1, 2011 5:53 PM | Link to this

The gov and people in the Ohio House and Senate are doing exactly what they were voted into office to do. As a tax payer and retired on Social Security I’m sick of seeing my property taxes keep going to pay high wages and increased benefits to government workers and teachers. In all the years I worked I never had wages and benefits as good as theirs, so why should I have to keep them more and more. It has to stop somewhere. We live in a democracy where the majority is suppose to get their way. I am in that majority and we won the election. It’s time for us to have it our way for awhile.

By Bill + 1

March 1, 2011 5:50 PM | Link to this

Over time workers have gotten tired of being stepped on and formed Unions to support themselves. When times are bad they have worked with Employers and Gov’ts and bight the bullet with concessions. Every dime a Union member gets in benefits is gotten in lieu of wages on their checks so they are already paying their own way. Every worker on the planet has the right to belong to a Union if they so desire but Scum like kasich and walker feel the tax breaks for their rich friends should be on the backs of workers. Jealousy has more to do with anti union feelings. Try organizing your own jobs instead of complaining about those that have.

By A Confessing Right Wing Hypocrites

March 1, 2011 5:32 PM | Link to this

Made $50k a year as a very part time instructor at Ohio State. My credenitals are just B S degree, Faux News commentator, worked for a bankrupt Wall Street firm that loss millions of dollars for Ohio pensions. Greatly increased the salaries of my cabinet members and staff while trying to cut the pay of most public employees. Who am I, Governor K-sick of course. Making Ohio sicker every day.

By Schooled

March 1, 2011 5:31 PM | Link to this

I am HUGE fan of saving money but I saw the new “pay scale” for teachers today. My husband is a teacher (who wants a career change and FIRMLY believes that teachers are overpaid)and even he was shocked. Starting pay is 21,000 and the top of the pay ladder is 36,000 (masters plus 11 years).This is all based on MERIT PAY, and teachers can make more, but the percentage has not been released yet. Merit Pay is on paper a good idea but how will they pay some teachers like special ed? Those students will never have the ability to pass tests, so merit pay will have to be determined differently. Also what about courses like language or business that don’t have a standardized test and aren’t minimum requirements for the state, but required for Schools that want to maintain an “excellent” rating. My greatest fear is that the ones who will be hurt are the children.Who is going to actually be a great teacher if their maximum pay is 40,000 with merit? I mean you could manage a waffle house and make more. Also, what college student wants to pay (or take out loans) to become a teacher if there is no way to make it back? I am all for cutting spending and diminishing the role of unions, but when you mess with public service wages, then people will certainly suffer. I also fear for this Dayton area that is already struggling, because if this pay scale passes and the average teacher is making 20,000 less, you can bet Dayton businesses are going to feel the pain.

By Health Care Morons

March 1, 2011 5:30 PM | Link to this

So now the Tea Bagging idiots are bringing Health Care into this debate? How pathetic. You’re the same kind of Glen Beck idiots that carried rally signs saying: “Keep government out of our Medicare.” And for the record, no one took over your health care. All that basically happened is some welfare cheats now have to pay for some coverage instead of getting unlimited emergency room care at taxpayers’ expense. And, oh yes, insurance companies can’t deny coverage for prexisting conditions. That “taking over healthcare” comment is a witless comment from a Fox News puppet who doesn’t even understand what the adults are discussing.

By blamegame

March 1, 2011 4:54 PM | Link to this

I read with interest the comments here.Folks cant even agree to disagree.The United States of America has become The Divided States of America.

By ha

March 1, 2011 4:52 PM | Link to this

8500 is a number that DDN came up with, its more like 3500! Typical!!

By Laura

March 1, 2011 4:50 PM | Link to this

How can 8,500 people be protesting are these all Union tax paid workers so we can do without them working it appears

By John

March 1, 2011 4:46 PM | Link to this

TUUA - Great POST!

By hey

March 1, 2011 4:46 PM | Link to this

Trying to Understand Union Anger…I bet you work more than nine months out of the year too. The Unions have been spoiled for far too long… the mentality is blurry at best!! It has become a union of welfare that pays cash and has benefits! Keep your union dues and pay for your health care and retirement people! Your salary will not change!

By null

March 1, 2011 4:45 PM | Link to this

police and fire ARE low skilled positions as far as education goes.Jobs.com a few years ago did the research.Not trying to offend,just reporting facts as I read them.

By Braying at the Moon

March 1, 2011 4:41 PM | Link to this

All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach. Adolf Hitler

By Braying at the Moon

March 1, 2011 4:40 PM | Link to this

All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach. Adolf Hitler

By Quit Crying

March 1, 2011 4:40 PM | Link to this

Robert, I commend you for your service to your community. But, as you said yourself, you chose this line of work. No one, and I mean no one, is making you stay. If you leave, they will train a new one to do your job. Everyone is replaceable. Get over yourself!

By null

March 1, 2011 4:33 PM | Link to this

Really?! The amendment puts wages back in?! That’s like closing the barn doors after all the chickens are out. Sure, now you that you’re going to make them pay 20% of thier health insurance premiums, employeers can now expect wage demands of 23%. Awesome!

By Trying to Understand Union Anger

March 1, 2011 4:33 PM | Link to this

I’m a middle class non-union employee in the private sector. I get paid a fair wage, but I can’t strike. I have zero job security. I can be fired for any reason at any time. I can’t tell the company I work for how much I want to pay for healthcare. I can’t retire after X years with a pension. I can retire when my 401K has grown large enough. I have to save 20% of my income and take risks in the market for my future. I don’t get a guaranteed number of sick days every year. I can’t carry over and build a leave balance from year to year. I don’t get subsidized healthcare when I retire. I don’t dream of retiring until I am at least 65-70 years old. Everyone I know is just like me. I am a middle class non-union worker. I do not hate unions, but I don’t understand how you guys think you have it any rougher than the vast majority of American workers.

By Robert loves himself

March 1, 2011 4:33 PM | Link to this

Robert, we now understand that you are greater than great. You are the only one in the city that has a purposeful job. I feel blessed knowing that you exist. Thank you for showing us how great you really are. A true legend in his own mind.we bow to you.as far as having a degree, you must have been looking for a free ride. It seems you may have found one ….for now that is….freeloading of the taxpayer is way of life to you people.Use your degree and PULL YOUR OWN WEIGHT

By ??

March 1, 2011 4:27 PM | Link to this

Robert, there are a lot of men/women that would love to do your job….you act like there are so few people that would be willing to police/fire fight/or nurse work! Come on,wake up!!

By Leslie

March 1, 2011 4:27 PM | Link to this

Where were all you union members when we were standing up for our healthcare? Where were you when we were trying to stop the democrats from taking over our health care? That’s right you were laughing at us, calling us nasty names, and yes even physically attacking people. You called us uneducated racists. Now what are you doing? Oh standing up for your rights. Didn’t care about our liberties don’t care about your liberties. Our rights are god given natural rights by nature’s law. You are fighting for a government right and we told you be careful what you wish for because a right that government gives you can be taking away as well. Get back to basics and stick with your God given rights.

By ??

March 1, 2011 4:27 PM | Link to this

Robert, there are a lot of men/women that would love to do your job….you act like there are so few people that would be willing to police/fire fight/or nurse work! Come on,wake up!!

By Jim

March 1, 2011 4:27 PM | Link to this

Why are millionaires and billionaires getting tax breaks, while teachers,cops, firefighters, and other public employees getting screwed and being vilified? Come on, even you jealous private sector guys can’t defend the tax cuts. The Republicans are all about establishing a plutocracy.

By Robert

March 1, 2011 4:24 PM | Link to this

Oh and one last comment, instead of being jealous of what someone else might have and hoping its gets taken away, blaming the worlds (or states budget) problems on them. How about evaluating your position, and if you dont think you get paid enough in compairison for your level of education or experence, do something to inprove your situation. We arent looking for a raise, and most all of us have already made many concessions. We are simply fighting for what we think is right.

By Get over it jim

March 1, 2011 4:24 PM | Link to this

Dear Jim, I guess you haven’t seen the requirements to work for Dayton police.I have seen the recruitment card being handed out .You better take a really close look.no drugs after the age 25. Prior convictions are ok. Etc…take a real close look Jim……sorry to bust your bubble, but the glory and fame you seek is only in Hollywood….the movies can deceive you Jim….ask dean Lovelace what the requirements are now……

By Robert

March 1, 2011 4:17 PM | Link to this

Oh and thanks for the personal attack on “Pull you own weight”. I have a degree.. to actually in electrical engineering and emergency medical services. I do what I do because helping people is why I chose this path. I’m sorry that the thought of that is so foriegn to some that the solution is to simply walk away when something happens you dont like instead of continuing to fight for the things we need to survive and care for the people we are sworn to serve, even you.

By toody

March 1, 2011 4:14 PM | Link to this

teachers have master degrees. How much should someone with a masters get paid? That’s a lot of school to pay for

By Jim

March 1, 2011 4:09 PM | Link to this

@I agree, You think cops and firefighters only job requirement is to”read and write”? You’re an idiot.

By Robert

March 1, 2011 4:09 PM | Link to this

Oh and for all of you that say find another job. If all of us did go for greener pastures who would be left to protect you? Do you really want public safety forces and educators who are fine getting paid the rock bottom. Come ride a shift on an engine or medic in a big city and see the worst of this world. How many lives have you tried to save? How many children have you helped be born… How many nights do you spend thinking about the ones you couldnt…

By I agree

March 1, 2011 4:05 PM | Link to this

If the job doesn’t have the benefits and pay that you think are good enough, THEN FIND ANOTHER JOB. police and fire jobs are paid well in Dayton. These are well paid jobs that require no college.if you don’t like it,then go to college and find a new career. How many other jobs pay this well for only having to be able to read and write?I have seen the requirements needed to get a job on the police and fire.yes it’s a dangerous job, but I knew that before I decided to go to college instead.I had better expectations of myself and knew that I needed a career that I could support my own with expecting someone else to pay for it.I agree in the previous post, mourning for a living is a sorry way to go..Pull your own weight….

By True Story

March 1, 2011 4:04 PM | Link to this

Before the November election 2010, I told you so, ‘Any public employee - teachers, policemen and firemen etc that votes for K-sick is voting themselves out of a good job.” Voters remorse big time.

By been there done that

March 1, 2011 4:04 PM | Link to this

@jack, you are correct but you must not have read the fine print. He left the door open to hire more people in the future. I assume you don’t think that will happen.

By I agree

March 1, 2011 4:04 PM | Link to this

If the job doesn’t have the benefits and pay that you think are good enough, THEN FIND ANOTHER JOB. police and fire jobs are paid well in Dayton. These are well paid jobs that require no college.if you don’t like it,then go to college and find a new career. How many other jobs pay this well for only having to be able to read and write?I have seen the requirements needed to get a job on the police and fire.yes it’s a dangerous job, but I knew that before I decided to go to college instead.I had better expectations of myself and knew that I needed a career that I could support my own with expecting someone else to pay for it.I agree in the previous post, mourning for a living is a sorry way to go..Pull your own weight….

By Jim

March 1, 2011 4:04 PM | Link to this

Tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires, but yet Republican Governors want to scapegoat and attack Firefighters, Police Officers, Teachers, and other state employees. I hope all you cops/teachers/firefighters,etc who voted for Kasich learned your lesson. This is an attack on the middle class, and anyone making less than 200k should be worried. They want us all working for $10.00 an hour.

By Robert

March 1, 2011 4:04 PM | Link to this

Facts about my healthcare and retirement. 1)Both single and married fire fighters in my city have had premium increases of over 110% over the past few years. 2)I fund my pension, you don’t I contribute 10% of my salary to it increase to 12.5% over the next three years. Ours is ran buy the Ohio Police and Fire Pension Fund. 3)I have NO HEALTHCARE at retirement, not even the ability to buy in to the plan former members had. 4)DROP costs cities less, its a fact they dont have to train new employees. Please make sure you know what we actually get and you actually pay for, remember my taxes pay my own salary too. It also pays the money my city uses to throw a several hundred thousand dollar forth of july party when it says it has to lay off safety forces. If your house is burning down are you interested in fireworks? I’ve spent my entire life in public service, the Marines, the Fire Department, the National Guard, OIF. I have bled for what I have.

By 90% of Middle Class is Non Union

March 1, 2011 4:03 PM | Link to this

90% of working middle class workers do NOT dictate to their employers what they will contribute to their healthcare and retirement plans. State union employees should be no different. If you want to bargain for wages and working conditions, that’s fine. But the employer ultimately determines the rest. That’s the way it works for 95% of American workers! Leave your secure state job and find out how MOST of us live!!!

By Jack

March 1, 2011 4:01 PM | Link to this

@Been there done that…come on. Evidently you fail to read. Kasich is paying the same money as Strickland did, just using less people. Not a hard concept.

By ??

March 1, 2011 3:55 PM | Link to this

And if you don’t like the changes that are coming…find another job!! Nobody is making you stay, I’m sure there are thousands of people out there that would gladly take your position with all of the cuts!

By bucky

March 1, 2011 3:55 PM | Link to this

how do you rate a teacher’s proformance? Every kid is different and some are destined to flip burgers at McDonalds no matter how “great” a teacher is. If pay is based on this, inner-city schools would have a very hard time hiring teachers. I guarantee if you took what you think is a “bad” teacher from the city of Dayton schools and put her in Oakwood, she would be great

By Quit Crying

March 1, 2011 3:53 PM | Link to this

Robert, please stop crying! No one is holding a gun to your head making you be a fire fighter. If you can’t take the physicality of the job, please get a job in the private sector. Then you’ll understand what getting “beat-up” is all about!

By been there done that

March 1, 2011 3:51 PM | Link to this

I am a state employee and I will be glad to pay more for my medical and retirement when I get the same 30% raise Kasich gave his buddies (cabinet members).

By ??

March 1, 2011 3:49 PM | Link to this

You are not making sense Robert and I don’t mean that in a bad way. We are all struggling and we all need to take a hit. The lifetime pensions and health care are the focus here. Your salary will not be affected. The taxpayer can no longer afford to fund your retirement and full health care for life and his/her own.Most of this money is borrowed! The well is dry!

By Robert

March 1, 2011 3:44 PM | Link to this

Everyone is talking about what money collective bargaining may or may not save the state, I would like to pose the question of what it would cost those affected by the change. As a member of a large city fire department I depend on collective bargaining to insure for my wellbeing and that of my family. We depend on our ability to negotiate with our city to ensure that important issues like health insurance are in place to protect our lives. Which are in turn the lives of those who protect you. If the cities are able to have absolute control over such aspects of our employment then I feel you will see the quality of care for ALL people drop. I have to have good health insurance because of increased risk to myself for both physical injuries and work exposures to disease. In the ten years I have been employed I have suffered two back injuries, one broken finger, two significant exposures to hazardous chemicals, three exposures to infectious diseases, one burn, and bumps and bruises to numerous to count. And all of these I have suffered gladly to protect the people of my city. Workers Comp of course cares for most all of this, but the follow up care for those problems that are created from those injuries usually fall on my normal health insurance (I feel like I’ve been kicked in the back every morning when I get out of bed). And as for exposures to infectious diseases the big ones are also cared for by WC but what about all the flu’s and cold we get due to constant contact with sick patients. If my health insurance wasn’t there, if we hadn’t fought all these years to ensure it was there to protect us, I likely wouldn’t be still on the job today, my body simply wouldn’t be able to take it. If you find a fire fighter who doesn’t max his deducible every year it’s likely he hasn’t been doing it long. And I know that without collective they won’t do away with our healthcare of course. But I know that the quality of a plan, amount of my contribution, and my ability to insure my family will change so greatly that it will take its toll on me and my fellow brothers and sisters across the state. And as we get more worn down our ability to care for the people of this state will likely drop too. This I am most definitely not trying to sound as a treat but more I think a fact that I believe is hard to argue. We get beat up more than a lot of occupations out there and our ability to perform doesn’t just affect our livelihood, but our citizen’s lives. But I always have light at the end of the tunnel, after I retire on average I’m only expected to have to suffer through the aches and pains for roughly seven years before I die, so please Mr. Gov. take away our ability to protect our benefits. As for my friends on the police departments they suffer the same issues, and as for teachers they may not have the physical strains that we do but really think about it, THESE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE EDUCATING THE GENERATION OF PEOPLE WHO WILL BE INCHARGE OF YOUR GOVERNMENT IN THE YEARS TO COME!!! We need them to be the best we can get; I mean really watch the movie Idiocracy…. Its happening and they are the only people who can stop it. I don’t even really care about wages, money is just money, the thing we really need is our healthcare, and collective bargaining is the only tool we have there to ensure we have what we need.

By John is Clueless!

March 1, 2011 3:43 PM | Link to this

You all are wasting your breath with John W. He doesn’t have a clue. Not now, not ever. He feels he is entitled to a better life. Instead of trying to better himself and his situation, he would rather tear-down those of us who do try to make things better!

By funny

March 1, 2011 3:40 PM | Link to this

My,my,my how things have changed since 18 months ago. I remember reading all of the posts about the “tea baggers” and how they were a joke. Now look at them..they are changing the structure that has had this country bleeding for years! The debt is out of control,but just like most that have bad credit…who cares..just keep charging those credit cards! Well people we are seeing the worm turn and it will carry over for the next decade!! You are seeing history in the USA!!

By Carrie

March 1, 2011 3:29 PM | Link to this

The police and fire employees are the biggest cry babies. I am glad the governor is taking action ..wait until the governor goes after the double dippers in these two crybaby unions. The DROP program is next on the list….thank you governor for finally put a stop to the moucher society.these two unions make welfare mouthing seem minor..

By Former Private Sector Worker

March 1, 2011 3:27 PM | Link to this

I worked for a Fortune 500 company for 18 years. I am now a “state” employee (but non union). State employee benefits are absolutely MORE GENEROUS than those at my previous private employer. I do NOT believe taxpayers should subsidize my overly-generous benefits.

By Stop the TP

March 1, 2011 3:24 PM | Link to this

STOP the tea party Natzis and white supremist. They are out to destroy America!

By Terrence

March 1, 2011 3:20 PM | Link to this

all this fuss about the poor police and fire is utter BS. They get special treatment for everything. They are the biggest whiners and complainers On the the cities payroll. If the job is too dangerous , then find a different one. You crybabies knew this was the nature before you accepted the position. As a taxpayer, I am tired of the crying and complaining.let’s get some employees in there who might actually be thankful for what benefits they do have…

By Squirrellygirl

March 1, 2011 3:19 PM | Link to this

All the tea party has done is draw attention to excess spending our government can no longer afford. You can blame the unions (and Obama) for putting the car companies out of business, and now they are trying to do the same with our own government. Unions are communist. Look at their signs, their logos, who they support with their money. Follow the money. Somebody should be investigating the unions and their antics…

By died in the wool

March 1, 2011 3:17 PM | Link to this

all i can say people is you can’t suck me any drier, and i’m in a union. you can’t cut my wages, they haven’t risen in 3 years, you can’t take my medical, it’s a joke anymore costs have doubled. what else do you folks want? I’m not rich, and my pay is comparable to the private sector. My retirement fund reflects my 18 years of loyalty to public service. Wait and see how wrong this is … I pay taxes too, at the same rate as everyone else. I lose my job, you lose my taxes

By Perspective

March 1, 2011 3:17 PM | Link to this

@John W. So tell me John,what is a more fair portion of taxes? Do you know what % they pay now? If you don’t know how much how can you say they aren’t paying a fair portion? Now let’s see if you’ll answer my questions. (Doubt it)

By Mike R

March 1, 2011 3:15 PM | Link to this

Anon is correct. What is wrtitten is all true.

By Clint

March 1, 2011 3:15 PM | Link to this

Shannon Jones of Springboro and Gov Kasich need to face the protesters and give them an answer ,If this is the right thing to do for Ohio . Not sure if this is a political move against the Unions or Republicans vs the Democrats but the Republicans have been fighting Unions for decades . The working class in america needs representation for benefits and wages + retirement . American workers have fallen behind other Industrialized Countries . Plus ,The Wealthiest Americans are represented in America and have the Bush Tax Cuts for another 2 years while the working class loses more and more . Who is fighting for the working class in America ?

By TP Gone

March 1, 2011 3:11 PM | Link to this

Shannon Jones must go down…The Tea Party must go down…The Republicans need to take responsibility for our budget problems by padding their pockets and stop trying to pass the buck to the little guys. These Tea Party illiterates think they are privileged and something is owed to them. It is time to stand up to the Tea Party and say enough is enough.

By john.smith

March 1, 2011 3:09 PM | Link to this

It’s funny how people in favor of this Bill are ignoring the fact that this also includes police and fire in the effects it will take. What message does this send to them? Thanks for what you do, risking your lives, but because the real problem, doctors are charging more and health insurance companies are charging more, we are going to strip your rights, use you as the scapegoat for our state’s financial problems (see the article about states with unions compared to without, and let the healthcare field continue to charge as they please! When will we see a Bill restricting what can be charged for healthcare?

By Bill

March 1, 2011 3:07 PM | Link to this

FC, so you’re saying that the states that don’t have unions are lacking in fire/police/teachers? I didn’t think so.

By Tom

March 1, 2011 3:06 PM | Link to this

Yes to cutting teacher salaries. These overpaid complainers need to experience the recession and then they wouldn’t take days off their job to protest.

By Squirrellygirl

March 1, 2011 3:03 PM | Link to this

In case you wondered where all the comments went, they went to the OTHER article that DDN created before this one. It was called UPDATED: Dayton sewer worker fires up protesters - “8,500 protest against SB 5 in Columbus - biggest turnout so far”—actually they started out with 7,500, but DDN upped the number and then added another blog. The other one is quite controversial. It must be hard for DDN to keep switching it up on us so that we can lose replying to the controversial comments. Huh, DDN? The real truth is that Unions have lost support in the private sector because they drove up the cost of services/products so high that they drove businesses out of business, just like the car companies that are no more. Now, Obama has moved our tax money to Mexico to make cars. Nice move there, Obama. And the public sector where the salaries come directly from our taxes? The unions are driving the state to make terrible decisions, like being forced to lay workers off or be allowed to renegotiate public workers’ contributions to their pensions and benefits. Rightly so since comparatively they don’t contribute as much and get to retire much earlier with greater pensions that the private sector. Unions are, essentially, putting the government out of business, just like they did with the private sector. There was a time that unions did good, but that time has long passed away. They are no longer a help to the worker nor employer. Unions are now a huge political contributer. You get one guess as to WHO they are in bed with. I will give you a clue. His name is Obama and he defends the union by switching your attention to the workers. Of course we appreciate government workers, but everyone has a budget, and we have to live within ours, so why should our government continuously be able to mandatorily take more of our hard earned money because they aren’t even trying to live within THEIR budget? Huh? And Kasich is doing the job he was elected to do. Good for you, Kasich. Those 8,500 (probably half that number) workers who all took today off to protest—I’m sure it was a coincidence that they all got the day off, like a holiday the rest of us in the private sector didn’t know about. They all had vacation days to spare to take it and use it to be BUSSED and protest and stand next to communists and socialists (look at their signs, that will give you a clue) and the scary union leaders who KNOW WHERE WE LIVE (I know because they tell us so). The unions bloody rhetoric should give you a clue, too.

By John W.

March 1, 2011 3:03 PM | Link to this

Anon, you need to stop lying to promote your agenda. The fact is that rich folks can cough up a little more money so I can have running toilets. They don’t pay a whole lot now. You’re lying.

By In Moderation

March 1, 2011 3:00 PM | Link to this

The system needs changing, at a minimum. Anyone who can honestly say it should stay status quo, isn’t honestly looking at things. This last year, the Wayne County Commissioners were told by a conciliator that they needed to pass a levy, or borrow money on interest bearing loans in order to pay higher wages to the deputies. Now that is intended to be a negative comment about the deputies, but rather a system that would permit an individual to cause such an action with only his/her saying so. If the commissioners borrow the money, you’re being taxed without a vote. It’s not the teachers, or the cops or anything but the system that needs changed. We cannot sustain the current way things are done. That’s why you’re seeing this all over the country.

By billy

March 1, 2011 2:58 PM | Link to this

how do you rate a teacher’s proformance? Every kid is different and some are destined to flip burgers at McDonalds no matter how “great” a teacher is. If pay is based on this, inner-city schools would have a very hard time hiring teachers. I guarantee if you took what you think is a “bad” teacher from the city of Dayton schools and put her in Oakwood, she would be great.

By Limit Union Power - Not Abolish

March 1, 2011 2:55 PM | Link to this

Solution: …..1) Allow collective bargaining for wages and working conditions ONLY …..2) NO collective bargaining for healthcare and pension benefits (these are rising costs that shouldn’t be carried by the taxpayer) …..3) END BINDING ARBITRATION

By DrowningInOhio

March 1, 2011 2:55 PM | Link to this

It is about time Ohio wakes up to what Vermont, South Carolina and Texas have already figured out: do not allow unions in the schools! Outlaw them before they bleed you to death. Look around our state and decide whether we can afford these part-time, high-priced complainers. STOP THE UNIONS IN OUR SCHOOLS! SUPPORT SB 5!

By FC

March 1, 2011 2:52 PM | Link to this

If this measure goes through, it not only affects the union people, but will eventually affect everyone from the middle class on. The services we have come to rely on will no longer be there for us. Police and firefighters will not be able to have quick response times, or have the needed equipment or staff needed to assist the people. Services will disappear slowly but surely. Our children will not have the materials or attention needed to learn and grow. Special education will not be viable for the schools to provide. The educational supports- libraries,school tutors, and many other programs will slowly be cut down. All the social services like the food bank, social services, outreach programs will be gone. It is not just the unions that will suffer - it will be all of us. We need to stop government overspending and pork barrell projects that are the real cause of our fiscal emergency. Do we really need to know the sex life of mosquitoes? Or support Kasichs office workers’ high wages? That money has a lot more use than what it is being used for.

By Anon

March 1, 2011 2:49 PM | Link to this

John, you obviously received a public school education. Corporations don’t pay taxes; they pass those costs onto the consumer. Raising corporate taxes merely increases the costs of goods and services to you and I. The top 1% of tax payers earn 20% of the income and pay 40% of the taxes. The top 10% pay 90% of the taxes. How much more can you take from them before they close up their businesses, retire, and/or otherwise leave for more tax friendly environments, leaving the state with fewer jobs for working people and zero income for the state to tax? People that are currently members of public employee unions earn at least 1 1/2 times as much as their private sector counterparts, pay nearly 0% for their health insurance versus 20% for those of us similarly employed in the private sector, and they contribute nearly 0% towards their retirement versus the 5% average paid by those in the private sector. Their union dues are collected by the state (and are essentially a perk paid by the taxpayers) and virtually all of union money donated to people running for political office are given to Democratic candidates. Unlike private sector unions, where the rank and file negotiate directly with the company (meaning everyone with a vested interest in the negotiation is seated at the bargaining table); public sector unions negotiate with politicians—the very people they pay with their “dues” to ensure their elections—not the taxpayer from whose pockets the funds to pay those public sector union employees. Public sector union employees also enjoy more benefits in terms of vacation pay, holidays, and paid time off than their private sector counterparts. The bottom line is that it’s time for public sector employees to “pay a more fair portion” of the bills, especially when Ohio is $8 billion dollars in debt and can’t afford to continue to overpay public sector union employees.

By Leslie

March 1, 2011 2:39 PM | Link to this

Up through the 1950s, unions widely agreed that collective bargaining had no place in government. But starting with Wisconsin in 1959, states began to allow collective bargaining in government. The influx of dues and members quickly changed the union movement’s tune, and collective bargaining in government is now widespread. As a result unions can now insist on laws that serve their interests – at the expense of the common good.

By ohiodale

March 1, 2011 2:37 PM | Link to this

Linda - they are not saying they are cutting wages. Can you read? Other states and the federal government do not have collective bargining and workers get raises every year. I pay taxes also which covers the wages of state workers and I am for this bill. Tax payers should have the final vote since we pay the salaries.

By Numbers tell the story

March 1, 2011 2:35 PM | Link to this

John W., You omitted the downtrodden sewer workers. Politifact, A billion in potential savings sounds like money when the state is staring at an $8 billion dollar deficit. Three areas in the budget are sucking this state dry: Incarceration, medication, and education.

By Who

March 1, 2011 2:35 PM | Link to this

Unions in Private sector GONE. Unions in Public Sector are in the bullseye. One newsite was reporting deals between CEO;s and Govs of Oho, Wisconsin,Indiana? Any truth?

By Linda H

March 1, 2011 2:32 PM | Link to this

Cops, firefighters, teachers,state employees and all union workers pay STATE income tax. Cut their wages, cut the state INCOME.

By Leslie

March 1, 2011 2:30 PM | Link to this

The founders of the labor movement viewed unions as a vehicle to get workers more of the profits they help create. Government workers, however, don’t generate profits. They merely negotiate for more tax money. When government unions strike, they strike against taxpayers. F.D.R. considered this “unthinkable and intolerable.” Government collective bargaining means voters do not have the final say on public policy. Instead their elected representatives must negotiate spending and policy decisions with unions. That is not exactly democratic – a fact that unions once recognized. Up through the 1950s, unions widely agreed that collective bargaining had no place in government. But starting with Wisconsin in 1959, states began to allow collective bargaining in government. The influx of dues and members quickly changed the union movement’s tune, and collective bargaining in government is now widespread. As a result unions can now insist on laws that serve their interests – at the expense of the common good.

By Amazed

March 1, 2011 2:27 PM | Link to this

Address the real burden on the state budget..Welfare and Entitlement programs. Neither party wants to lose their voting base by attacking the non productive parts of our society.

By NCR

March 1, 2011 2:26 PM | Link to this

Hi I am the NCR Corporation. This is why I left, you did not treat me very nice. Sorry you lost the tax dollars I generated. By the way all the cool kids in Georgia love me!

By politfact

March 1, 2011 2:25 PM | Link to this

This bill is only about politics. The bill will not save tax dollars. NEA supports democrats. Unions support democrats. Get rid of the unions= get rid of the democrats. Republicans keep blaming money, but that is not the truth.

By John W.

March 1, 2011 2:13 PM | Link to this

Stop blaming cops and teachers for budget problems. Legislators like Jones need to TAX SMARTER. Stop giving corporations and six-figure-earners tax breaks. Make them pay a more fair portion of the bill.