Carroll Commencement
Fairborn commencement
Badin graduation
Ellen Belcher is the Dayton Daily News opinion pages editor. She writes about state government, education, the environment, higher education and all things Dayton.
Martin Gottlieb is an editorial writer and columnist for the Dayton Daily News opinion pages. He focuses on the political process itself and does such national issues as war, the economy, taxes and Social Security, as well as a hodge-podge of local and state issues.
Scott Elliott is an editorial writer and columnist for the Dayton Daily News opinion pages. He writes about education, city and suburban issues, politics, business, workforce and consumer issues.Home > Blogs > A Matter of Opinion > Archives > 2008 > October
October 2008
Obama infomercial leads into World Series
I watched a chunk of Barack Obama’s infomercial tonight just prior to the last game of the World Series. It was a mix of images — Obama speeches, interviews with blue collar voters and Obama talking directly to the camera at times. He spoke from a room that bore a strong resemblance to the Oval Office. It was nicely produced. The World Series was a bit more interesting.
Were you persuaded? If you watched Obama’s ad, let us know what you thought.
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TweetWhat did John McCain say in Kettering Monday?
Over at Real Clear Politics you can read for yourself the transcript of John McCain’s speech in Kettering Monday at Fairmont High School. McCain hit Barack Obama hard on taxes, playing up Obama’s “spread the wealth around” comment during his encounter with Joe the Plumber in Toledo.
Meanwhile, Obama was giving what has been called his “closing argument” speech across the state in Canton.
Take a look at both transcripts and let us know who is making the more persuasive case for his candidacy in the final campaign week.
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TweetJohn McCain begins final full week of campaign in Kettering
We’re getting into “closing argument” time in the presidential campaign and clearly Ohio still matters. John McCain will be in Kettering Monday at Fairmont High School.
While the national polls are leaning heavily to Barack Obama, McCain remains strongly competitive in the Buckeye State. Where do you think Ohio will end up? In the red column, or the blue?
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TweetSay it ain’t so, Samuel!
I’m disappointed. It turns out “Joe the Plumber” who John McCain made famous in Thursday’s debate is not really a plumber. And he’s not officially a Joe either. The New York Times is reporting Joe the Plumber is actually Samuel J. Wurzelbacher of Toledo and Wurzelbacher is not a certified plumber or contractor. He also owes back taxes.
It now seems more than coincidental that Wurzelbacher, a registered Republican, claimed to Obama to be the perfect case to expose a weakness in Obama’s tax plan that could hurt some small businesses.
The situation as I understand it is this (business experts, pleas chime in with additional info if needed). Some small sole proprietor-run businesses pay their taxes through the business owner’s personal income tax return, rather than through a business tax return the way a corporation would. It could be a problem if the small business’ profits boost the business owner’s net income from just below $250,000 to just above that figure.
Under Obama’s tax plan, crossing $250,000 could boost the business owner’s taxes from 36 percent to 39 percent. And that additional 3 percent paid in taxes would be a significant hike in tax expense.
Wurzelbacher claimed to Obama that he was trying to purchase the plumbing business he worked for but the higher taxes might make it harder for him to afford it. I wonder if his story will still add up after a couple days of media scrutiny.
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TweetThe Joe Plumber Debate
Overall, I think this was the best of the three debates. McCain was the most on his game of any debate. And Obama was the most direct in answering negative charges. It was well moderated with good questions and the candidates actually debated and mostly stayed on task.
As the debate went along, I got the sense McCain’s emotions got the best of him. He hates to lose a point. If Obama hit back hard on anything, McCain had a hard time letting it go and in a few instances he devolved to a mocking tone. I don’t think that plays well.
But for anyone who leaned toward McCain and was looking for a reason to vote for him, he may have given them some reasons. He did a better job making his points than in other debates. If first impressions hold, he seemed reasoned, level-headed and knowledgeable.
As I said a few times tonight, I mostly thought Obama played prevent defense — he tried not gamble or make mistakes, which meant he did not stray often from his basic messages. His best moments were hitting McCain hard on negative campaigning.
Who do you think won the debate? Vote in the poll over at the DDN’s Ohio Politics blog.
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TweetStretch run: Will McCain finish strong?
10:08 I think McCain started very strong for the first 20 minutes or so. Then Obama began to hit back and McCain was knocked off stride. McCain’s campaign hinges on a strong finish.
10:10 This question about the supreme court demonstrates how the country is leaning left this year. Abortion comes up and the Republican candidate insists opposition to abortion or other “litmus” tests should not be required. The Democrat unabashedly says Roe vs. Wade was correctly ruled. In the past, the Republican would directly say abortion is wrong and Roe should be overturned. The Democrat would have bobbed and weaved and avoided a direct answer.
10:15Yeah! An education question! Although the question is a little overly breathless. But its a blog for another day about whether international comparisons are as bad as they seem.
10:20 Obama gives his education talking points. Pre-K, college affordability, more funding, more pay for teachers, parental responsibility. McCain says we have “achieved” equal access to quality education for all? Has he been to the inner city? Now he’s hitting hard on school choice as the solution, citing New Orleans, and saying money is not the problem.
10:25 Weird snorting, cackling laugh by McCain at the end of the education question as he said Obama wants to junk vouchers because there aren’t enough of the. Probably not the lasting image he wants viewers to have.
10:30 Overall I think McCain helped himself a little bit tonight. Was it enough to reverse Obama’s momentum? Prediction #1: McCain will gain a point or two in the tracking polls this week. Prediction #2: This will cause panic among some Democrats but Obama will continue to play prevent defense. Will it work?
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TweetNegative ads get a lot of air time
9:40 Obama is working very hard to try to diffuse the Ayers issue.
9:41 McCain started strong but he is struggling to keep up the attack on Ayers, ACORN, etc.
9:43 Good questions so far from Bob Scheiffer — the economy, negative campaigning, running mates. These are issues that need to get out on the table. The running mate question is dangerous for Obama. He doesn’t want to beat up too hard on Palin. So he spends the time praising Joe Biden. McCain: Palin is a role model to women and a reformer. Both playing it safe here so far on this question.
9:55 McCain rolls his eyes when Obama says he opposes trade agreements while unionized workers face violence in Columbia. Says Obama will meet with rogues like Hugo Chavez but not agree to trade with our “strongest ally in the region.”
10:00 Star of this debate: Joe the Ohio Plumber. Please tell me he is from Dayton! Joe, you are about to get some media calls.
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TweetAnticipation over: Debate begins
9:00 Did McCain get his tie out of a time capsule from 1973? And is it just me or is Obama suddenly starting to go gray over the ears?
9:13 Joe the plumber from Ohio gets a lot of air time thanks to McCain. Is Joe from Dayton, by chance? McCain has brought up a real issue. Very small business owners who pay their business taxes through their personal tax returns could pay more taxes if they are considered “high income” under Obama’s plan. Obama isn’t clear in his answer. He appears to be saying tax breaks to middle income payers today will be the entrepreneurs of tomorrow. Pretty strong answer for McCain, who alludes to “socialism” by talking about Obama “spreading wealth around” and asking why anyone should pay more taxes now, even wealthy families.
9:20 I am shocked that McCain speaks in a complimentary way about the Home Owner Loan Corporation, a federal arm that helped managed the mortgage system during the depression and in the post-depression era. HOLC was also a powerful force in housing discrimination. HOLC managers in every city, including Dayton, created maps and drew lines in conjunction with local realtors and banks that restricted “bad” neighborhoods with minorities from getting good loans at good rates. This helped created America’s urban ghettos by trapping African-Americans who could not buy homes or move to the suburbs.
9:25 Overall I think McCain is doing well, but I would not have brought up George Bush. Obama is hitting him hard on the similarities between Bush and McCain on economics. But McCain is much more effective tonight talking about his accomplishments in the senate.
9:30 McCain gets tossed the big question about negative campaigning. He bizarrely he starts by brings up the town halls that never happened. McCain then paints Obama as the bad guy by citing John Lewis. Will this fly with the public? Obama is the negative campaigner?
9:32 Obama: The PUBLIC thinks McCain is the dirty campaigner. But overall, Obama isn’t treating this as a trap question to hit McCain. He is trying to dismantle McCain with a step-by-step reply. It appears he is trying to take the high road. This is the prevent defense with a big lead in the fourth quarter.
9:35 Obama brings up the “kill him” statement and “palling around with terrorists.” Then he says this is harming America. Interesting how his is addressing this very directly. McCain replies that he is “proud” of the people at his rallies and tries to suggest they are veterans, so Obama is criticizing veterans. I just can’t imagine people are buying this from McCain.
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TweetHas Obama set a trap for McCain?
So here’s what everyone is anticipating with tonight’s debate: How will John McCain bring up William Ayers?
To recap, since the last debate McCain and running mate Sarah Palin have relentlessly hit Barack Obama about his connection to William Ayers, a one-time member of the violent 1960s group the Weathermen. Obama sat on a non-profit board with Ayers in Chicago and Ayers held a “meet the candidate” event for Obama at his home when Obama first ran for office. Ayers now teaches education at the University of Illinois at Chicago.
Obama’s running mate Joe Biden criticized McCain for not having the guts to make the charge to Obama’s face that he is “palling around with terrorists,” as Palin said in a speech. Obama repeated the “say it to my face” line since then. That prompted McCain to tell an interviewer that Obama has “pretty much guaranteed” the issue would come up at tonight’s debate with his challenge.
I can’t help but think Obama has laid a trap for McCain. He wouldn’t bait McCain into making the Ayers charge in the debate without a plan, right? So how will Obama respond?
He surely knows already what he will say. Perhaps he will directly challenge McCain about negative ads? Would he say something provocative, like calling the negative ads “sleazy?”
You would also have to assume that McCain has developed a counter strategy. Will he bring Ayers up in a non-confrontational way? That seems like a tough trick. Will he go right at Obama with the “terrorist pals” line of attack? And if he does that, does he have a comeback if Obama challenges him or uses some form of the “sleazy” countercharge?
No matter how it goes down, it’s hard to see how this wouldn’t be interesting.
Meanwhile there is this little matter of the economy. The markets had their biggest percentage losses today since the 1987 crash. Both candidates have recently trotted out response plans. This is THE issue of the election at this point. What can either candidate say to score points?
Finally, any objective observer would have to view this as McCain’s last stand. He is getting crushed in the national polls right now and losing nearly all the battleground states and even a few red states. He MUST find a way to change the momentum tonight.
McCain doesn’t have much to lose. Will this mean he will try to push the envelope or be unconventional in some way? McCain has often been at his best when he takes the unconventional road.
That’s a lot to watch for. I’ll be live blogging starting at 9 p.m. As you watch the debate, follow along here at Matter of Opinion.
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TweetDebate live blogging coming to this space at 8:45 p.m.
Just a reminder that we will again be live blogging here at Matter of Opinion during tonight’s debate. I’ll be sharing my impressions and observations throughout the debate starting at about 8:45 p.m. You can give us your reactions in the comments during and after the debate. So pull the blog up on your computer and follow along as Obama and McCain mix it up.
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TweetAn outsider’s view of politics in Troy
A really good website to look at for analysis of presidential polls is FiveThirtyEight.com. It’s a left leaning blog but the data work is done by Nate Silver, who is a highly respected baseball statistician.
This month, Nate and his partner are traveling the country visiting the presidential swing states to report what the situation is on the ground. On Sunday, they visited Troy.
Their report is optimistic about Barack Obama’s chances in Ohio, based on enthusiasm for Obama in a heavily Republican county like Miami County. According to the story, Obama’s Troy office has had 800 volunteers this year, or the equivalent of 4.5 percent of the 17,606 John Kerry voters in the county in 2004.
Will this translate to higher Democratic totals in Miami County and other rural, Republican Ohio counties? And if so, could the surge in Democratic enthusiasm have an effect on local races down ticket?
Let us know what you think will happen in the comments.
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TweetColumnist Krugman wins Nobel
Paul Krugman, a columnist for The New York Times who appears on the Dayton Daily News opinion pages, won the Nobel Prize for economics this morning.
I run hot and cold on Krugman’s commentary. He has a gift for explaining economic theories and principles, but he can be a partisan. I prefer his explanatory columns to his rants, but maybe that’s just me.
He gets a $1.4 million prize. The question of the day: Where is he going to put it and why? I don’t know anybody who has that kind of money in their bank account or mattress, but it’d be nice to know how confident he is in the markets that he’s been studying and writing about.
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TweetDDN: Obama best choice for president
In Sunday’s newspaper, the DDN editorial board will endorse Barack Obama for president of the United States. Take a look at what the board had to say by following the link and come back here to share your comment. If you agree, tell us what you find convincing about the board’s argument. If you don’t agree, give us your rebuttal.
Remember there are many points of view out there about the presidential race and everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. We’d like to have an exchange of ideas here without the name calling that is so common on political Web sites. The endorsement represents the view of the newspaper’s editorial board, a group chosen internally to craft opinions about issues that are important to our readers.
We have simple rules here on the Matter of Opinion blog — no hate speech, no profanity, no libel and no name calling — and the comments on this blog are moderated. Avoid those pitfalls and your comments will be approved. We look forward to thoughtful commentary and criticism here, whether you agree with the newspaper’s position in its endorsement or not.
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TweetThe Big One
OK, time to cut through all of it and make a pick. Tell us who your choice for president is.
But just to keep this a little bit fresh, try this:
Make a case that you think might resonate with undecided voters, that is, people who aren’t already Republicans or Democrats, liberals or conservatives, and won’t be reached by the kinds of cases made by Rush Limbaugh and the liberal blogs.
Thanks
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TweetDayton was pretty interested in the debate
Nielsen, the television ratings company, reports Tuesday’s presidential debate got much better ratings than the first McCain-Obama debate, but not as much viewership as Biden-Palin.
It seems Daytonians were pretty interested in seeing what McCain and Obama had to say. Nielsen lists Dayton with the 22nd highest debate viewership among major metro markets in the U.S. Dayton is the 64th biggest metro area in the country, according to Nielsen.
Only Columbus (ranked 10th) had higher viewership for the debate among Ohio cities, The top two cities were Nashville and Memphis in Tennessee (the debate was held in Nashville), but the rest of the top ten included a lot of swing-state cities in Virginia, Indiana, North Carolina, Florida and Missouri.
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TweetCandidates largely take the high road
Much of the conventional wisdom out there before this debate said it was third down and long for McCain and he needed a blockbuster play to get back in the game. His campaign has hit Obama harder on television ads and in speeches this week. This led many to believe McCain would come out swinging with lots of attacks.
McCain didn’t do that. He did not get emotional or attack Obama in the overt ways he and Sarah Palin have on the stump lately. He seemed instead to be trying to counter the impression some have that he is angry or unstable by staying on an even keel and projecting a friendly posture.
The trade off may be that he didn’t make any big plays.
Who do you think won the debate? Tell us in the comments and vote at the DDN’s politics blog here.
UPDATE: Cruising the blogs, I am getting the sense that this was a win for Obama. Liberal blogs are either breathing a sigh of relief that he made no big mistakes or celebrating what they perceive as the way Obama connected with middle Americans. On the conservative blogs, there is a lot of complaining about McCain, saying he failed to hit Obama when there were openings and generally bemoaning what they see as McCain’s ineptitude.
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TweetHalfway through: McCain and Obama sparring
9:50 McCain has dropped Democrat-turned-independent and pal Joe Lieberman’s name twice now. Is that a good idea given Lieberman’s unpopularity with Democrats and social conservatives?
9:55 McCain: “Who voted for the bill? That one.” Pointing to Obama. This may remind viewers of the “no eye contact” McCain of the first debate. Can’t he just name Obama?
10:00 Obama says health care should be a right for Americans.
10:05 McCain echoes the winning “wrong, wrong” Obama line from the last debate, trying to turn it back on Obama. Obama responds by recounting his “wrong” talking points in reply.
10:05 Two-thirds of the way through the debate, no big gaffes, zingers or even memorable moments. Pretty boring. That’s good for Obama and bad for McCain.
10:10 Obama says we should go into Pakistan to kill Bid Laden. McCain says that sort of talk turns public opinion against the U.S. in Pakistan. He says we have to get that country’s support. This strategy succeeded in Iraq, he says. Do you think voters are buying his argument?
10:15 Brokaw is a disaster as moderator. He isn’t keeping the candidates on task and now he just waived the rules.
10:20 Obama forces McCain to explain his “bomb Iran” joke. He has to be happy about that.
10:25 McCain has done a better job explaining himself and showing off his knowledge on foreign affairs in this debate than in the last. Not sure he has scored any big punches though. Has he done anything to sway undecided voters?
10:30 Interestingly there were no serious personal attacks by either side. We did not hear the names “Ayers” or “Keating,” for instance. The candidates were polite and largely indirect in their criticism. I noticed Obama did not address McCain directly as often as he did in the first debate (repeatedly calling him “John” rather than “senator” last time). I think McCain did make some eye contact this time. This all made for less fireworks but voters who are weary of the onslaught of negative ads (especially here in Ohio) may appreciate the more positive tone.
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TweetAnd we’re off: McCain and Obama debate begins
I’ll be writing updates throughout the 90-minute debate with my impressions and reactions to what we see and hear. Please join in by adding your thoughts in the comments.
9:00 The town hall format tonight would seemly make it hard for the candidates to avoid eye contact with each other. They are seated very close together on stools without podiums and the audience is very close, even reaching slightly behind both men. Should be interesting to see how the candidates interact with each other.
9:08 McCain’s answer to the financial crisis starts with “energy independence?” Seems like an odd place to start. But he goes on to say he would order the treasury to buy up home loans.
9:11 Good question from Tom Brokaw about who would be secretary of treasury for McCain and Obama. McCain mentions Meg Whitman of eBay. Obama mentions Warren Buffet. Both would be very different sorts of outsider picks.
9:20 You can really see the intimate nature of the debate in the way the candidates criticize each other. It seems to force them to be more indirect (“he did not sign the letter” or “I have to revise his history.”). A direct attack (such as Obama’s “wrong, wrong, wrong” zinger last debate) is tougher to pull off when both candidates are walking around right next to each other and real voters are practically in their laps.
9:25 McCain is noticeably more comfortable in the town hall format. He just looks more relaxed and does a good job of engaging the audience.
9:30 Now Obama, given a choice to pick his top priority, says energy independence, much like McCain’s prior answer. Is it just me, or is it odd that energy is the first thing on the minds of both candidates after the Dow Jones Industrial Average lost 1,000 points in two days?
<9:30 Wow, did Obama really make education his No. 3 national priority? As a former education reporter I’m pleased. But education has gotten almost no discussion during this campaign thanks to the economy, the war, health care and energy.
9:35 OK, so far this is a pretty boring debate, even more boring than the VP debate to this point.
9:40 Obama gets the first zinger — “straight talk express lost a wheel on that one” regaring McCain’s tax plan. Not sure if it was clear what he meant, tho. I had to run it back on TiVo to get what Obama was saying. Almost seemed like Obama had a canned zinger that he just needed to throw out there.
9:45 I think Obama is doing a good job explaining his proposals. He really walked through his tax cut plan point-by-point in an easy to follow way.
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TweetWhat are you expecting from tonight’s debate?
John McCain would seem to have a much tougher task tonight than Barack Obama. He has fallen far behind in the polls and is in search of a game-changing event. An ordinary debate tonight that generates no buzz for McCain would be a set back. He simply must make some headway.
How might he do that? On the campaign trail, McCain and Sarah Palin have begun a series of direct attacks on Obama’s experience, character and personal associations. Will McCain make those charges in a debate? Doing that effectively could be tricky, as he does not want to come off as angry or mean. That tends to turn voters off.
Meanwhile, McCain might try to correct the impression some people had from the last debate that he was contemptuous of Obama. His body language and noticeable avoidance of eye contact led people to view him as less likeable.
Now, doing both at the same time — seeming more likeable while attacking Obama in the manner of the past few days — would be a tough task. If he has to choose, which way will he go?
The bar seems low for Obama. If he avoids gaffes and comes off looking presidential he probably meets his goal for the night.
What else does he want to accomplish? Perhaps he may seek to make a case that he has a plan to fix the economy or to reassure voters about his foreign policy experience? If attacked by McCain, will he attack back with equally hard-hitting countercharges? This is something else to look for.
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TweetJoin us again for debate live blogging tonight
As we did with the vice presidential debate last week, we’ll be live blogging tonight’s presidential debate here started at about 8:45 p.m. Keep the computer nearby as you watch the debate and keep refreshing this blog every few minutes. I’ll be writing updates continuously throughout the debate with impressions and reactions. Join the conversation by posting your thoughts in the comments.
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TweetScott Elliott: Can new media fill void left by newspapers?
On my first day as a journalist, I was led into an arena and locked into a mud pit with a bunch of fast moving farm animals, a couple of which almost ran me over.
For a college-fresh kid from the East Coast and lifelong urban dweller, the “calf scramble” at the Clark County Fair was a crash course in the small-town definition of “news” that readers counted on from their modest weekly newspaper.
That newspaper, the New Carlisle Sun, closed Sept. 10 after 12 decades of letting people in town know who died, who had run-ins with the law, what that darned city council was up to and, yes, which local kids won ribbons at the county fair.
Beyond the personal sense of loss (learning a newspaper you once worked for closed feels a little like watching a wrecking ball pulverize your childhood home), the demise of the New Carlisle Sun is a potentially ominous harbinger. As the news business skids and slides its way toward an Internet-based future, will the messengers of Main Streets past come along, too, or just completely fade away as relics of a more tactile past?
As more small towns see their news sources vanish, will the World Wide Web ultimately deliver those one-time broadsheet readers to the future where somebody will care to provide their news to them online?
I hope so, because small towns bubble with great stories about interesting people.
It was a kindly New Carlisle city councilwoman I had met earlier in the day who recognized me heading for the bleachers at the calf scramble and escorted me to a “privileged” post ankle-deep in mud in a show of small-town hospitality. She meant well.
Here’s how a calf scramble works:
One side of the pit has a couple dozen high school boys wearing football helmets. On the other side are far fewer nervous calves that are big enough to knock you flat. At the signal, the boys dash after the calves, and anyone who harnesses a calf and drags it to the winners’ circle takes the animal home.
The next year the boys bring them back to be judged, and those who cared for them the best get cash prizes.
Not that I knew any of that at the time, as I sloshed around taking shaky notes and shooting rotten pictures between frequent duck-and-cover maneuvers.
The fun was only getting started.
Later I ran a front page mug shot of Wilbur the potbellied pig, along with a sympathetic story of the house pet with a gentle soul who was expelled from his warm home and loving family when cranky neighbors got a councilman to push through a new ordinance against harboring farm animals within the city limits. Wilbur squealed all the way out the city hall door after the council voted to exile him.
But it wasn’t just about livestock at the New Carlisle Sun.
A story I wrote got a city council member impeached five years before Bill Clinton made it fashionable. She also was acquitted, but they ran out of chairs in the council chambers for the crowd that showed up to watch.
The town boasted a crazy cast of characters — vindictive cranks who declared war over petty issues like curb maintenance and alley clearance; embattled city officials trying to keep the streetlights on while fending off personal attacks; back-room dealers looking out for themselves or their friends; and council meeting blowhards. Those are the sorts of personalities novels are based on.
But my favorite people in town didn’t get most of the headlines. They were the regular folks, good people just living their lives, raising their families and dropping 50 cents each week to read about what was going on around town.
It’s the folks who’d call me to complain if they hadn’t gotten their papers by 6 p.m. (so I could drop one off on my way home) that I feel for now.
For 126 years, the New Carlisle Sun was there for all of them every Wednesday afternoon.
For the sake of small towns everywhere, I hope the next age of media doesn’t forget about them.
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TweetMemories of the “calf scramble”
In my column today, I wrote about my concerns for small towns and the ability of small town resident to stay informed if the closing of the New Carlisle Sun, the first newspaper I worked for, proves to be a harbinger of more small paper closings.
I started off the column with a funny story about about covering the “calf scramble” at the Clark County Fair on my first day as a journalist. What is a calf scramble? If you’ve never seen one, it’s hard to explain. I took a stab at describing it in the column, but I went in search of video on the Internet that shows what it’s all about.
I couldn’t find any video from the Clark County Fair, but thanks to YouTube here is video of the calf scramble from the Champaign County Fair in 2006. Enjoy:
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TweetWe want your thoughts on the Dayton school levy
The DDN endorsed the city school levy Sunday, saying the city cannot afford to let the measure fail.
What do you think? Is this the right call? Are you voting yes or no? Add your voice to the comments at the Get on the Bus education blog.
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TweetBiden was right about “Bosniaks”
Last night I thought Joe Biden had gaffed by calling people from Bosnia “Bosniaks.” Turns out this is the correct term for Bosnian Muslims, as I learned from Talking Points Memo while cruising the political blogs this morning.
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TweetDoes this end the debate over Palin?
I think perhaps this debate will put to rest the Palin pick as an issue that possibly was hurting McCain. Palin came across fine. She didn’t sound confused or uninformed as she did with Couric and Gibson. And she conveyed her folksy likeability. There was some feeling that the Saturday Night Live mocking and stumbling replays from her recent interviews were raising doubts about McCain’s decision to pick her and hurting McCain in the polls.
If that’s true, I think undecideds possibly were reassured that Palin did not come off looking crazy or dumb. This may stem the conversation about Palin, move her off the national radar and move the discussion about the president race back to McCain and Obama. I think we may hear less and less about Biden and Palin after this.
What do you think? Is the debate about Palin over after Biden’s debate with Palin? Let us know in the comments.
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TweetIt’s over, no knockout
10:33 First dude and the family are on the stage now, as is the Biden family. And reactions? Post them in the comments.
10:38 The networks are knocking Palin a bit for getting the name of the general in charge of Iraq wrong, calling “McKiernan” by the name “McClelland,” and for getting the number of troops in Iraq wrong. Some liberal blogs are hitting her for saying teachers will “get their reward in heaven,” suggesting that means rather than in pay here on earth. But this stuff is nitpicking not big gaffes.
10:45 Just checking in on some conservative blogs now. They are pretty happy about Palin’s performance. Some are raving about her plain talk. They like her saying “Nice to meet you, can I call you Joe?” at the start. Others fretted a bit about her ducking a couple questions, but the mood on the right is pretty bubbly.
10:50Who won the debate? Vote in our poll at the DDN’s politics blog.
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TweetDebate enters the stretch run
9:57 About half an hour left and so far no big moments to speak of. I think Paliin has performed better vs. Biden than McCain did with Obama, at least in terms of body language and expressions. She comes across warm and likeable and hasn’t made a big mistake yet.
9:59 Is Palin reading off note cards? I just noticed she is looking down at the podium a lot. She just asked Ifill if she could talk about Afganistan and then appeared to shuffle with her hands. While Biden speaks she is looking down and moving her hands but we can’t see what she is doing. She also might be taking notes.
10:01 I think I’ve picked up a couple audible sighs from Biden during Palin’s foreign policy answers. Sort of reminded me of Al Gore’s sighs. But again this happened off camera. It might not have been a mocking sigh. It might have been a genuine deep breath. I couldn’t tell.
10:03 Are people from Bosnia really “Bosniacs?” That’s what Biden just called them. Aren’t they Bosnians?
10:05 Palin busts senators like Biden and Obama for “voting for it before you were against it” on war issues and says she doesn’t get that since she’s “an outsider.” That gets a big smile from Biden. Seems like he might have a comeback ready for that. We’ll see.
10:07 No big comeback from Biden. He launches into a discussion of Darfur.
10:08 Palin stumbles a little bit but gets rolling with “John McCain knows how to win a war.”
10:09 Palin wants to bring reality from “Wasilla Main Street” to Washington. Get government out of the way so it doesn’t put mandates on us and take our money, she says. And she says Obama will increase taxes.
10:10 Now Biden says walk the streets of Delaware and Scranton with me and see if they think the Bush economic plan is working for them.
10:11 Folksy Palin comes out. “There you go again looking backwards” at the Bush administration, she tells Biden. Winks at dad in the audience. Gives a “shout out” to an elementary school, giving extra credit to the kids who are watching.
10:15 With 15 minutes left, my wife says “this has been boring.” Good sign for Palin.
10:17 Palin bumbled a bit talking about the powers of the vice president’s office. Stumbled over her words, mostly. Not a gaffe. Biden calls Dick Cheney “the most dangerous vice president we’ve every had.” Says everyone should understand that the VP is in the executive branch. Palin said the constitution gives flexibility. Biden is killing Cheney, calling his executive branch argument for the VP “bizarre” and saying it has been bad for the country.
10:20 Biden brings up his wife’s death in a car accident to say he knows what life is like when things get rough. He also chokes up a bit talking about not knowing if his son would make it after the wreck. Interesting to see how this will play. Palin acted as if nothing happened and just went on with a prepared answer. I think she missed an opportunity to look compassionate and human by acknowledging Biden’s personal struggle in some way.
10:24 Biden is finishing very strong. He is beating McCain up for not being a maverick on “the things that matter” and throwing out a bunch of real life examples on things McCain voted against.
10:26 Biden also gives a good answer about changing his view on a tough issue by bringing up the supreme court and the importance of ideology of judicial nominees. It’s a subtle signal to supporters of liberal court issues like abortion.
10:28 Palin says she has never really had to change her view of any major issue because she finds a way to compromise. Weird answer.
10:30 No big winner tonight, which means Palin supporters have to be thrilled. Most people probably tuned in tonight to see if she would implode. She did not. Biden finished strong and overall did fine. But he was expected to win. He may have scored more points, but this was not a knockout.
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TweetNow we’re on to foreign policy
9:40 Palin hails the surge and says Obama didn’t support the troops with funding. She says even Biden criticized Obama’s vote.
9:42 Palin says we are getting “closer and closer” to victory in Iraq. Biden claims McCain also voted against funding the troops. This is getting into the murky senate voting process where there may be several votes on many bills depending on what has been added or subtracted.
9:43 Palin says Dems position is to “waive the white flag” in Iraq. Will these lines work with a public that is very opposed to the war?
9:45 Palin is using Biden’s words against him, especially things he said about Obama in the primary race.
9:46 Biden is hitting back hard on McCain on the the war, calling him wrong, wrong, wrong. Perhaps his most effective line so far, echoing Obama in the presidential debate.
9:48Biden at least sounds a lot more confident talking about foreign affairs than on domestic issues. He is trying to turn the conversation to Bin Laden, Afganistan and Pakistan.
9:52 Biden hits McCain on his gaffe for saying he wouldn’t meet with the president of Spain. I thought Palin would have an answer for that but she takes a pass. No zingers from Palin yet after almost an hour.
9:54 Does Biden not know whether this is the “seventh or eighth year” of the Bush administration?
9:56 Everybody loves Israel! Both candidates try to one up each other on their love for Israel.
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TweetDebate is underway; Biden and Palin mixing it up some
9:17 I notice Palin is talking less about Alaska than she usually does. She often turns questions about national issues back to things that happened in Alaskan politics. I wonder if she has been steered away from that.
9:18 Palin refers to Obama as “Barack.” Interesting since Obama in his debate also called McCain “John” the whole time. Palin says she is in the middle class and that government is the problem for families like her, citing taxes.
9:19 Palin stumbled a bit explaining McCain’s health plan, but not too badly. She seemed to get a bit lost in her words, warning about having health care taken over by “the fed.” But overall she is doing well presenting the McCain side of the issues. Now Biden is going deep into Obama’s plan and zings Palin by saying McCain’s plan is “the ultimate bridge to nowhere.” Gets a chuckle from the crowd.
9:22 Biden stumbles over “characterized.” But overall he seems pretty smooth. You can see his senate experience in the way he speaks.
9:23 Palin is sort of rambling while talking about Alaska and oil companies, saying she fought oil company “greed.” Not her best answer and she may get hit here for misrepresenting her work in Alaska.
9:27 Biden is beating the snot out of oil companies in his answers on energy, painting them as gouging consumers and trying to tie McCain to them.
9:29 Palin defends McCain’s campaign suspension and says he helped. Again a bumpy answer though with some awkward phrasing. She’s had a couple moments now where the echo of her network interviews could be heard. But overall she is coming off OK so far. Half an hour in, she has not had a big stumble.
9:31 Has there ever been this much talk about Alaska in a national debate?
9:32 Ifill goes after climate change, an issue Palin stumbled on with Couric. Palin talks more about Alaska but says she does not attribute all climate change to man’s activities.
9:34 Biden strongly asserts the cause of climate change is man made and suggests it is a fundamental difference that McCain/Palin don’t understand that. And Biden is now touting clean coal, which he panned just days ago.
9:35 Biden: “I have always supported clean coal.” Huh?
9:36 Biden now says his anti-clean coal comment was taken out of context and that he was referring to exporting the technology to China. There will be questions about this for sure.
9:39 Biden says the constitution requires benefits to same sex couples and expresses strong support for gay couples to have the the same rights as other couples. Palin says she is tolerant but said she worries about changing the definition of marriage. She says McCain would never prohibit gay couples from visitation rights. Biden now says he does not support gay marriage. He says this question should be left to the faiths to decide.
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TweetDebate is about to begin
8:49 Gwen Ifill is in her spot and warming up the crowd, waring about noise and such. I’m watching on C-Span. T-minus 11 minutes.
8:56 Here’s the first conspiracy theory of the night. A friend who is for Obama told me Palin will wear her hair down over her ears tonight rather than in her trademark bun. He thinks she is wearing an earpiece to receive instructions for how to answer. I think that’s more than a stretch.
8:59 What are the chances this debate is just boring and nothing of note happens? That would be a let down.
9:00 Here come the candidates. Palin’s hair is off the ears. No earpiece! :-) They greet each other politely. Both are wearing dark suits. Light blue tie for Biden.
9:05 Ifill starts off with a question on the bailout. A bit of a rambling answer by Biden. He seems nervous and wordy.
9:08 Palin takes us to a kids soccer game for an answer and tosses in a folksy “betcha.” Nice touches. Pailn’s a little wordy but made her points well.
9:09 Biden goes right after McCain, citing the “fundamentals of our economy are strong” quote that has haunted McCain. Palin was ready for it with a solid answer. And now she’s hitting Obama as a party line voter vs. the maverick McCain.
9:11Palin blames predator lenders for the financial crisis. So far she is doing well. She does not sound confused or uninformed.
9:13 Biden is all but ignoring Palin and talking only about McCain. He is playing the attack dog role. Some Democrats have complained he has not done this well. Biden’s making strong eye contact with Palin while she speaks.
9:15 Hmmm. Biden: “The governor did not answer the question about de-regulation.” Palin: I may not answer the questions the way you or the moderator want to hear. But I am going to speak straight to the American people.” They’re mixing it up some now.
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TweetLet’s talk expectations
So for tonight’s vice presidential debate, what should we be watching for?
—Sarah Palin. Everyone wants to know how she will sound. Will her answers be substantial or nonsensical, as her critics say she was with Katie Couric and Charlie Gibson? Does she actually not know much about national politics, or was she just nervous in other interviews?
There’s talk Palin has prepared some zinger lines to gotcha Biden or Obama, hoping the news coverage will focus on the one-liners in its post-game coverage. She was effective in Alaska gubernatorial debates being folksy and funny. But here she will have to be adequately substantive with her answers. That’s what everyone is watching for, and that’s her challenge.
—Joe Biden. There’s been a heavy focus on Palin’s missteps, but the truth is Biden has made a bunch of gaffes of his own and has a long track record of just the sort of bumble that could really hurt here. Meanwhile, he will have to handle Palin carefully. He can’t look mean or consdescending. And body language is important. Just ask John McCain about eye contact and facial expressions. Some experts think his posture in the presidential debate has contributed to his slide in the polls.
—Gwen Ifill. It’s kind of hard to believe the Presidential Debate Commission picked a moderator who was in the middle of writing a book about one of the candidates, but in fact Ifill is writing one about Barack Obama. The McCain campaign has publicly pressured her not to go too hard on Palin. And the debate format is reportedly very limiting. Those are a lot of issues to manage.
And pre-debate impressions? Share them in the comments.
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TweetJoin us here for live blogging during tonight’s debate
We’re going to try something new here at the Matter of Opinion blog tonight during the vice presidential debate. As the debate unfolds, I’ll be here posting some real-time impressions and reaction. We’ll be watching for gaffes and to see who is scoring points.
I hope you’ll join us here. As you watch the debate, pull this blog up on your computer and keep refreshing your screen for updates. If you see something we don’t, jump in with a comment. Or let us know about what you think of our observations. We’ll probably get started at about 8:45 p.m. and continue for at least a short while after the debate.
This has to be the most anticipated vice presidential debate in history. And with both Sarah Palin and Joe Biden having made a series of gaffes in recent weeks, it could be interesting.
I hope you’ll come along for the ride.
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TweetMaking a case to challenge an incumbent
As you probably know, I’m new to the editorial board. So these past few weeks have been an initiation for me to the endorsement process. During the couple months before an election, the DDN invites the candidates in key local races to come in and make their cases for why they should be elected. The editorial board listens to their arguments and we make recommendations to our readers about who we think would do the best job. Then it’s up to readers to decide if we convince them that we are right.
So over these recent weeks, it has been interesting to meet the candidates and hear their pitches. The extra burden on challengers is evident — they must make a case for why an incumbent should be turned out of office to make way for somebody new.
Those arguments are not always convincing.
My colleague Martin Gottlieb touched on this issue in the DDN’s recommendation of Miami County Commissioner Jack Evans.
Evans, an incumbent, is challenged by Judy Hartman, a quality opponent with a strong resume for public office. As with many challengers, Hartman is running under the flag of a minority party that rarely wins in her particular race. In this case, Hartman is a Democrat in a very Republican county. Just as often, we meet Republican challengers running in heavily Democratic areas.
Frequently, the argument at the top of these challengers’ lists for why they should be elected is the need for diversity of opinion. One party rule is dangerous, they say, so voters should elect them to represent a different point of view. Hartman, in fact, made the need for a Democrat on the Miami County Commission a centerpiece of her argument for her candidacy.
Fortunately, Hartman had more than just that on her resume. And that’s what challengers need — a persuasive argument for why they are the best choice for voters. Too often they make it sound like any Democrat or Republican will do.
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