Freshmen move-in day
Was house fire racial revenge?
Bodies ... The Exhibition
Commentary
Fourth down waffle may spell trouble for Lewis
Monday, October 29, 2007
> What did you think of Marvin Lewis' decision?
CINCINNATI — Here's a post-game comment from an unsettled Cincinnati Bengals dressing room:
"When your back's against the wall, you gotta come out and fight. If you curl up like a coward, it's gonna be a long season."
Extras
That was from receiver T.J. Houshmandzadeh.
It was not coach Marvin Lewis, who ended up in the fetal position on this one.
There are several reasons Cincinnati lost 24-13 to Pittsburgh Sunday and fell to 2-5, but there was one play, one decision, one big momentum swing that everyone was talking about afterward.
Down 14-3 with just over two minutes left in the half, the Bengals had a fourth-and-one at the Steelers' two yard line.
At first it looked as if Cincinnati was going to go for it and the record crowd roared in approval. Then Lewis called time-out and after some spirited sideline discussion — Houshmandzadeh admitted he and some other Bengals lobbied to go for the touchdown — the coach sent his field goal unit out as the crowd booed.
And while Graham did kick a 20-yard field goal, Pittsburgh got the ball back and promptly drove 67 muscle-flexing yards for a touchdown with four seconds left.
What could have been a 14-10 halftime deficit for the Bengals instead was a 21-6 Steelers' lead.
It may turn out that no one coaching move by Lewis in his five seasons here will have more of a ripple effect. The Bengals lost the game and any realistic shot at making the playoffs.
And such goal line timidity can cause a coach to lose stature among players. The fourth-and-one waffle showed a lack of confidence in his team, some indecisiveness on his part and could almost be construed as a moment of white flag surrender.
Not quite the caliber of Robert E. Lee at Appomattox Courthouse or the Japanese on the deck of the U.S.S. Missouri, but dramatic enough in its own right.
After the game, Lewis — now 0-6 against the Steelers at Paul Brown Stadium — admitted his team was out-played and he was out-coached:
"In hindsight I guess we should have gone for it on fourth-and-one rather than take the points. I didn't anticipate them driving down and getting a touchdown before halftime."
Although no player publicly
took Lewis to task afterward, some thoughts did surface:
"Against a team like (Pittsburgh) — when they're rolling like they have been on offense — you can't kick field goals, you need to put up seven points," said quarterback Carson Palmer.
While tackle Levi Jones said he supported Lewis' decision, another lineman disgustedly grumbled expletives about the call.
Had Lewis decided to go for it and the team failed, there still would have been an upside. He would have been saying "I believe in you guys."
Asked if he thought it was a sign that Lewis lacks confidence in the offense, Houshmandzadeh shrugged: "It could possibly be that 'cause fourth-and-1, why wouldn't you go for it?"
He suggested asking Lewis that at his Monday press conference. In the meantime, he offered his own assessment:
"I guess that's why Pittsburgh's a good team at 5-2 and we're the exact opposite at 2-5. Good teams get in the end zone and teams like us kick field goals."
Comments
By Mr dog
October 30, 2007 5:57 PM | Link to this
Nate you are a fool. “Almost” every single fan is on the bandwagon. If a team is that bad for that many years, any new fan to join the crowd should be accepted. Shame on you. Look at the reds same situation. I think that the real problem is that the staduim should be on the Kentucky side instead of the ohio. KY already owns the Ohio river, so let the fans in ky take over and see what happens then. It is a Theory if anyone would like to comment. Oh and like I said before bring you brown bags!
By Mr dog
October 30, 2007 5:57 PM | Link to this
Nate you are a fool. “Almost” every single fan is on the bandwagon. If a team is that bad for that many years, any new fan to join the crowd should be accepted. Shame on you. Look at the reds same situation. I think that the real problem is that the staduim should be on the Kentucky side instead of the ohio. KY already owns the Ohio river, so let the fans in ky take over and see what happens then. It is a Theory if anyone would like to comment. Oh and like I said before bring you brown bags!
By Lissa
October 30, 2007 1:55 PM | Link to this
WE LOVE YOU MARVIN
By Lissa
October 30, 2007 1:45 PM | Link to this
Marvin is a very good coach and we canot get rid of him for some bad seasons. We need to ask the owners why in the offseason did he not give us better support. No new linebackers. Our offense is set with just a few kinks. But until the owners come up off some money and get some better guys to back up our defense we are never going to have a winning season.
MIKE BROWN COME OUT OF THE POCKET AND SUPPORT YOUR TEAM!!!!!!!!!!
By boy-o
October 30, 2007 10:31 AM | Link to this
i saw this same team back in pre-season…..and said then..THIER NOT READY FOR THIS LEAGUE….THATS COACHING !!! plain an simple…3-things better drafting…better asst. coaching…mike brown gone…
By Nate
October 30, 2007 8:36 AM | Link to this
Marvin lewis is one of the best coaches we have had in a long time. But he has to help from fat chuck the defensive cordinator or anyone else on the coaching staff…at the end of this year i hope marvin gets rid of all of the defensive coaches and gets new ones…but also as fans we cant turn on the guy because of a bad season or a bad call its just funny that when we are winning you guys are all happy but when we lose everyone says fire marvin…you all sound like bandwagoners not real fans…
By Stone
October 29, 2007 11:12 PM | Link to this
The real question isnt why didnt they go for it, but in the world did they try to run it into the endzone from BEYOND the 10 yard line THREE times in the red zone against the best defensive team in the league against the run?! THATS STUPID BAD COACHING. THREE TIMES! Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. Three times and you are just a complete idiot and shouldnt be coaching or play calling.
By dstive65
October 29, 2007 8:12 PM | Link to this
Let’s look at it realistically. The talent is there. It would be hard for any team to compete when you start a defensive end at linebacker with two other guys who weren’t even on your roster until a month before the game and win. What I see is a team with a huge lack of confidence. Wins do alot to help that confidence. The problem is not Marvin. I think he has too much confidence in the Coordinators. Be a hands on coach. I saw Belicheck do that Sunday.
By Jon
October 29, 2007 7:23 PM | Link to this
Bengal fan from the beginning. Went flying at Joyce park Sunday. No radio, no Television, no Bungals. Think I will rake leaves next Sunday.
By steelernut
October 29, 2007 6:10 PM | Link to this
I’m just saying, bottomline, if Marv had gone for the TD, AND IF YOU HAD MADE IT, you STILL would’ve been down 14-10. The Steelers STILL would’ve gotten the ball back & scored like they did. That makes it 21-10. Final score, 24-17. It’s entirely hypothetical whether you would’ve made it. If they didn’t, you would’ve said he should kick the FG. Can’t have it both ways. REAL FANS STICK ALWAYS!!
By steelernut
October 29, 2007 6:03 PM | Link to this
By steelernut
October 29, 2007 5:58 PM | Link to this
By steelernut
October 29, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this
HEY HEY! Calm down, people!! Even though I was, of course, overjoyed by our Steeler win, you all need to realize a few things! 1. In the 15 yrs Bill Cowher coached, there were a few years when we did not have winning seasons (3). During ANY of those 3 times, any other owner would’ve fired the guy, but they didn’t. They KNEW this guy was a great coach and would get us to the Superbowl someday. After FIFTEEN years, he did! Marvin has been with you, what, 4 or 5 years??
2. S**t happens.
By BIG PAPA
October 29, 2007 4:45 PM | Link to this
HEY WHODEY THE STEELERS WILL SHOW THE LEAGUE WHAT LEVEL THEY ARE ON COME DEC. 9TH .THE STEELERS ARE COMIN IN THE AFC. TO BE CONTINUED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By WhoDey!
October 29, 2007 4:20 PM | Link to this
Bad news for Steelers: You are not even remotely on the same level as the Patriots, nor the Colts! The Bengals are a little banged up, and are inferior to most teams right now, including Pittsburgh. However, a win over the current Bengals doesn’t really warrant much of a challenge for the Patriots on Dec. 9th. Pittsburgh will be fortunate to escape the rest of their schedule with 5 wins. KEEP HOPE ALIVE Bengals Fans!!
By sam
October 29, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this
At this point I am again frustrated,and bewildered.Words cannot soothe the bruised and battered Bengals.Time to reach in,and open a serious can of whup a*s and take all this frustration and aggravation out on each and every team that opposes us from here on out.If we are now positioned to be nothing but spoilers from here on out,then lets be dammm good spoilers,..and start kicking everyones a*s on the field.Get off the pity pot,..and come out firing.No holds barred.
By BIG PAPA
October 29, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
ALL U BUNGLE FANS JUST NEED TO REALIZE THAT THE STEELERS ARE A REAL GOOD TEAM TAKIN CARE OF BUSINESS, THW BUNGLES HAVE WORK TO DO THROUGHOUT THE ORGANIZATION. KEEP WORKIN AT IT, LOOKOUT PATS & COLTS GO STEELERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By WhoDey!
October 29, 2007 4:02 PM | Link to this
We’ve had some pretty unfortunate losses to some key players since 2005, and have basically tried to patch a team together. Week 1, we were all praising Marvin and the team and saw a promising season on the horizon! Like all Bengals fans, we have sat through some tough seasons, and now we expect so much more!! Rightfully so!! But just remember that a few superstars are made by the efforts of the rest of the team. It’s a domino effect when one’s out. Don’t jump ship when times are tough!
By jimmyropes
October 29, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this
You all got great points but nobody has even brought up the last 3 minutes we were down by 2 scores and Bratowski was still runnin the ball. Even if we would have scored we still would of had to force the steelers into a 3 in out and as a fan of the Bengals you know how often that happens. Did they loose faith in carson too, come on let him air it out and give us atleast a small chance. When we got that ball back there was plenty of time and we just waisted it away. Get rid of both coordinators.
By jimmyropes
October 29, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this
You all got great points but nobody has even brought up the last 3 minutes we were down by 2 scores and Bratowski was still runnin the ball. Even if we would have scored we still would of had to force the steelers into a 3 in out and as a fan of the Bengals you know how often that happens. Did they loose faith in carson too, come on let him air it out and give us atleast a small chance. When we got that ball back there was plenty of time and we just waisted it away. Get rid of both coordinators.
By Jon C.
October 29, 2007 3:31 PM | Link to this
Marvin does have his problems, but the real problem is MIKE BROWN! We will not have a winning franchise, regardless of the coach, until Mike Brown gives up complete control of the team. Look at his record. Everything has changed in Mike Browns 16 years in charge except the losing and his family’s control of the team. You can change coaches, but as long as Mike Brown is in charge you want change the losing attitude and tradition.
By Barry
October 29, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this
Marvin has GOT TO GO!! He acts like he doesn’t know what to do with the Bengals. Well, HE IS THE COACH - It’s his JOB to figure it out and then DO IT! What are we paying him for?? He admits he get’s out-coached by a FIRST YEAR coach? Are you kidding me?!?! If Marvin gets out-coached by rookies, then HE SHOULD BE FIRED! Amazing. Marvin Lewis is clueless. He’s obviously way over his head and not competant to continue to coach in the NFL. Let him go coach a high school team somewhere.
By Doco
October 29, 2007 2:16 PM | Link to this
Marvin does tend to have that “I don’t know what to do next” look on his face most of the time. I always hoped it covered up the confindent and prepared interior. As for going for the field goal, he has to understand that the defense isn’t good and can’t stop the Steelers and that he NEEDS a touchdown there. It’s great to show your defense you believe in them, but not when you don’t! Motivate them by telling them that they are worthless and they need to prove him wrong!
By BengalFain
October 29, 2007 2:04 PM | Link to this
We can talk about Marvin all we want. Talk about firing him, but I think a better idea would be to talk to our defensive coach, possibly even our offense. Marvin might have the final say, but we all know how conservative he is. That’s his mentality and it won’t change. We all praised Marvin when we went to the playoffs, why bash him now? You know he is not the ONLY coach on the team. There are plenty to take the blame. All I have to say is WHO DEY! I do not quit on my team, OUR team!!!
By B Cowher II
October 29, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this
Just discovered more discouraging news for Bengals fans … C Palmer is now ranked 10th among NFL quarterbacks (90.7 efficiency). Even more discouraging, Jon Kitna (remember him?) is ranked ahead, at #9 (93.5). And the only Ohio winning team’s quarterback, D Andersen, is ranked #5, just .1 point behind Dallas’ T Romo. My, he’s standing tall, and not because he’s 6’6”.
By Mr dog
October 29, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
Look marvin has got to grow a bag! He has no confidence in his team and stands on the sidlines like a school boy b***h! I am a bengals fan and anyone with a brain would laugh at the article above. Levi Jones sucks and is just trying to cover his a*s b/c of his awful playing this year. I think he allowed almost 5 sacs on palmer in one quarter before marvin noticed.Marvin inherited the Baltimore d-fence, he is not a defensive coach. Bring your brown BAGS!!!!!
By Namhard
October 29, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this
Marvin decision was right at the time. You put yourself within one score and you are saying I think my defense will hold them. Maybe Marvin does need to go maybe not. He has had some questionable draft picks. He also has no linebackers left. Think about the first game he had his full compliment of backers and they played great. Since then he has had to plug in players who were not even in camp to play linebacker and that is a huge problem. I worry more about the offense which has struggled
By MrB.Cowher
October 29, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this
I enjoyed abusing the Bungals so much during my coaching days, that it is very hard to stop “cold turkey”… plus they just make it SOOOOO easy!!!!
By D Mahle
October 29, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this
Mr. Cower: I am disappointed that you feel the need to continue in your efforts to humiliate and degrade our team. Do you not have anything more substantive or important to occupy your time? I’m surprised that even post-retirement you continue to act in such an immature and unprofessional manner.
By Will
October 29, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this
When Marvin Lewis was hired i was all for it. I thought it was a great hire. The guy was going to bring a tough defensive mind set to this sorry franchise. But woow how things have went down hill. Now 5 years later he is admitting that he was out coached by a rookie head coach! Its time for him to go. This team is terrible and looks just like the Bruce Coslet teams, no discipline no heart. Put Marvin out of his misery and fire him, because he looks and sounds clueless!
By MrB.Cowher
October 29, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this
I forgot one thing… WHO DEY…. WE DEY!!!!
By BJ
October 29, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this
Marvin Lewis has been given more than enough chances to take the Bengals to the next level, but he hasn’t. The type of players he drafts, the lack of discipline on the team, horrible defense, bad calls, and then admitting that he got out-coached?? I guess even he thinks that he is not a good coach. I agree. I don’t want a coach that doesn’t have confidence in himself or his team. He has NO leadership qualities. He can’t motivate his player and he has already given up on this season. FIRE MARVIN!
By MrB.Cowher
October 29, 2007 11:10 AM | Link to this
Sorry all you Bungals fans but I would not lower myself to come and coach at a second rate organization where I would have little to no say over personnel decisions. I pride myself on being a football TEAM coach and not a bunch of “me first” players who only care about themselves. Marvin was a great coach before he came there as is Dick LeBeau after he left… I refuse to have my good name soiled by the likes of a second tier organization who gets their draft lists from the Ohio Penal League.
By Ronnie
October 29, 2007 10:45 AM | Link to this
Marvin has had his chance. We need a coach like Bill Cower.
By patrick
October 29, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this
Marvin was the best thing to happen to the Bengals, but he needs to step it up. We have a good team but right now coaching is letting us down. 4th and 1 on the 2yrd line that is a no brainer. Marvin could take a few lessons from Jim Tressel
By Mike K.
October 29, 2007 10:08 AM | Link to this
Just a thought, wouldn’t it be great if we had for once a real head coach with real head coach experience.
By deuce
October 29, 2007 10:06 AM | Link to this
I don’t know what’s wrong with the team or what can be done to make it better. What I do know is that the defense needs to go to the ‘Ohio State School of Form Tackling’. Why do Bengals DB’s and others go into tackles tucking in their arms and ducking their heads for a shoulder tackle that the offense just bounces off of?? Watch how Ohio State’s defenders go into an open field tackle. It’s an all out charge, open arm wrap tackle. Learn something!
By Mike K.
October 29, 2007 10:04 AM | Link to this
Just shows that Marvin has no confidence in this team. After yesterdays pitiful game I hoped Marvin would do the right thing and resign. How can the team show respect for him. His statements about being out coached and out played tells it all. How long are we going to accept the lame excuses, the stoic look and the look to the future, cause this is a rebuilding year. As long as the fans come out to the game and the game sells out why would Mike Brown make a change?
By Lisa
October 29, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this
Yeh, we may not make the playoff’s, but we could still have a winning season, and from what we had for many many years I’ll take a winning season anyday. We do have a good defense, we’ve seen it. Marvin just needs to get mean. And if we have a losing season there is always next year. Everyone is entitled to a bad year.
By Jonah
October 29, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this
This game is the nail in the coffin, in many ways. The Bengals won’t make the playoffs. And Marvin needs to go.I have supported him until now, but he had to go for it on 4th and 1. When your record is 2-4, and you’re playing against a superior team, and just last week the D gave up a touchdown at the end fo the half, you need to pull out all the stops.
By boxter
October 29, 2007 9:30 AM | Link to this
Marvin has to go. He is a joke. He was supposed to be a defensive genius, and the Bengals are the worst def. team in the league. 4th & 1 and you have a top 3 offense and don’t go for it? I would fire him today, but they won’t because the place was SOLD OUT & that is what it is all about there. The FANS are the real LOSERS for wasting money, not Mike Brown. Don’t blame Mikey boy, the people keep going & he doesn’t have to spend money.
By Lisa
October 29, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this
You all should be ashamed of yourself. This is our team you are talking about. You have to take the bad with the good and NEVER give up. Marvin has become real soft and that does need to change NOW. I believe no matter what you just have to believe in your team. I still believe they can pull their heads out of there butts. As far as firing anyone how about the defensive coordinator. And please give up the race issue. He came in a good coach and I believe he still has it in him. WHO DEY
By David
October 29, 2007 9:15 AM | Link to this
As much as I like Marvin, I think it’s time for him to go at the end of this season. Him and his whole team looked weak and pathetic, like they’ve already packed it in for the year. I didn’t see any fight at all in this team, that really needs to change.
By steve
October 29, 2007 9:07 AM | Link to this
It’s time for Marvin to go. He’s got that deer-in-headlight look we’ve seen on many ex Bengal coaches. His decsions are now construed as headscrathers. He’s lost the players too.
Can we make other wholesale changes? Naming a GM might be a good idea. Increasing the scouting dept., makes sense plus drafting defense and only defense. I’m hard pressed to think of any other organziation who would put up with this nonsense for so long. Okay, maybe Arizona but that’s it.
By Morgenholz
October 29, 2007 8:51 AM | Link to this
While the NFL WAS pushing for black coaches, I don’t really think that had anything to do with Marvin being hired, any more than had anything to do with Romeo Crennel or Art Shell or Mike Tomlin being hired. These guys all know football (well, except Marvin, maybe) and are good coaches. They were hired on their merits.
By KP
October 29, 2007 8:42 AM | Link to this
John, so you’re saying that one of the main reasons why Lewis was hired was because “the NFL was pushing for black head coaches”? Did you have this same opinion two years ago when the Bengals were 11-5, and the Bengal defense was turnovers left and right? I bet you weren’t questioning his coaching skills then! The Steelers, Browns, Colts and Chiefs (and the Bears last year) don’t seem to be doing too bad now, do they? All the Bengals problems they have and you boil them down to RACE? Brilliant.
By Coleman
October 29, 2007 8:40 AM | Link to this
Of course it was the right decision. It was the END OF THE FIRST half. 14-6 going into halftime.. If you want to blame anyone, blame the Kickoff team for giving up field position right before half; and the defense for letting them drive sitxysome yards in two minutes. What about the Watson fumble? What about Leon Hall’s nonexistance? taking the field goal was the right decision in the first half.
By howard
October 29, 2007 8:32 AM | Link to this
The Bengals have only got 2 quality players on offense Carson and TJ and whovever decides to step up on game day make 3. Look for Palmer and TJ to want out of their contracts with these other thugs and bums they have to carry.The rest of the team is at best 2nd string on any other NFL team. Marvin may have been great at Baltimore but he peaked as defensive coordinator he made some bads drafts for the team. Time for Marvin to go a nd the NFLn to step in on Mike Brown. Bring a Forrest Greg
By Phil
October 29, 2007 8:16 AM | Link to this
PITIFUL
By Mike
October 29, 2007 8:05 AM | Link to this
Every owner in the NFL but Mike Brown would be taking Marvin to task.Could you imagine Jerry Jones and his coach laid an egg like that …Whew. All of you sheep, just keep following Marvin and Mike …they will fleece you every time. If you expect a winner year after year, you better root for another team.
By sue
October 29, 2007 7:54 AM | Link to this
Marvin Lewis’ defense is terrible but this offense should be putting up 40 points a game! It is past time for a coaching change.
By tom
October 29, 2007 7:51 AM | Link to this
Anyone who still believes that this team will make the playoffs, well I have some swamp land that I want to sell you. I don’t see a Marvin Lewis team making the playoffs any time soon.
By BP
October 29, 2007 7:51 AM | Link to this
Fire Lewis, he has lost this team and his nerve. The defence sucks to let a team go 67 yards before the half and score again…not only did the HC give up so did the team. We need a total revamp of this team. Its sad because we have more talent now than we have had in many years. I think another coach COWER would do much better with just a few key personnel changes.
By john
October 29, 2007 7:48 AM | Link to this
Marvin Lewis is the coach of the Bengals for two reasons. One, he was at the right place at the right time when he was defensive coordinator of the Ravens. Two, the NFL was pushing for black head coaches. The play of the Bengals defense speaks loudly for his lack of coaching skills.
By bill
October 29, 2007 7:45 AM | Link to this
Why is Marvin Lewis still the coach of this inept awful team?